571. Rory and Alastair Challenge Ed Miliband on Israel-Palestine

So, so let, let me come to the sort of, uh, I think the, the, the kind of pr- principled question and then the architecture question.

On the principled question, this is an ugly phil- phrase, but plurilateral alliances are really, really important.

I'm gonna be convening ministers at, to UNGA, uh, not just on, uh, alongside Jordan on Gaza, but also on climate.

Climate security, one of the biggest national security is, uh, threats that we face alongside AI and, uh, those coalitions, building those coalitions, incredibly important.

On your specific point about Europe, uh, it is really interesting that you say this.

I wasn't really struck at the Gymnich, um, which is this EU informal foreign ministers', uh, uh, meeting, because you had, uh, Canada there- You had Iceland there who just said no to, uh, accession, uh, talks.

You had Norway there, you had the UK there, you had Ukraine there.

I, I, I'm very open to, to the kind of thing you're talking about.

And, and how formal it is, I don't know.

But, you know, countries working together on these issues, uh, on a whole range of issues alongside u- us having a stronger and deeper relationship with the European Union, I think is really, um, profound and important.

But isn't what the post-war settlement showed is that you do need international institutions, and essentially what we got a lot of questions about Mark Carney's speech-

Yeah

... going from that.

It was a very important speech-

Yeah

... back in Davos.

Speeches matter, as you and I both believe.

Yeah, we both believe that, and we always have done.

But Mark, Mark Carney's speech was, was interesting because he was really the first to say, "This is a rupture, not a transition." Now, we can have a debate about that, but he actually th- I think is leaning into a post-US hegemonic world.

He is saying that to leave the world in the state that it is with only the US and China as the driving powers, and as you say, Britain does have a role in this, so shouldn't we be leaning into that more, actually trying to think through new structures to meet some of these challenges we're talking about?

Yeah, and I'm o- and I'm open to that.

I, I look, leaning into our relationship, uh, with the European Union, you know, in my s- first week I was in Manila at the ASEAN Foreign Ministers meeting, but the second week I deliberately, you know, went to, uh, Paris, went to Madrid, you know, i-i-I think, you know, forming a d- a deeper, closer relationship with the EU, uh, whether it's on defense or security or trade or all of climate, all of those issues is crucial.

I just also want to say about the US, though, you know, maybe foreign secretaries tend to say this, but I, I do believe it, the enduring alliance with the US also matters to us.

Mm.

Matters for NATO, matters for trade, matters for defense, matters for intelligence, all of those things.