Oct 27, 2026 · 1 hr 8 min · 14 segments
What is natural law? How do we form "oughts" from observations about the world? In this episode of the Kenwood Institute Podcast, Institute director Tom Sculthorpe has a conversation with Dr. Drew…
Drew SparksGuest
Tom SculthorpeHost
Yeah, I mean, there's going to be different ways of discussing natural law and what people think it is.
There's a lot of individuals who I'm grateful for that write on natural law, especially in the evangelical tradition, who I would disagree with on how to formulate these things precisely.
But you made the comment about, is it Roman? I just want to say natural law is...
Like we have to, we want to remember that, you know, that Augustine was one who was willing to talk about eternal law, natural law, divine law, and human law.
And you see him doing that in his writings, but it's not even really Augustinian.
And so you can find it in Aristotle, right? You can go back to some of these great philosophers and see these seeds of natural law present.
Does it come to maybe a full flower in the time of the medieval ages from Augustine up into someone like Thomas Aquinas? Sure.
By the time you get to the Reformation, are there those who are holding to various versions of it? Are there differences about how we conceive of our relationship to God and the obligation that we owe to God and what grounds maybe the goodness and the obligation that's present? Yeah, there's differences, but I think there is a good grounding there.
in the reformed tradition but not just the reformed tradition because again i want to say this is this is more of a christian thing right um and it's not even uniquely christian because again people like aristotle are going to be able to to hold to it so what is it we're referring to when we refer to this thing that's natural law when i'm when i'm going after natural law i want to have like a very robust understanding of nature as such I don't want to develop an account of natural law that is really a repackaged version of covenantal law.
Do I think covenants are extremely important? Yeah, I mean, like you said, we were just on a few weeks ago talking about Baptist covenant theology.
um i'm a pastor i open the text regularly for my congregation um 80 90 times a year and walk through the texts and the covenants and explain all these things um so i care about those things i care about a christological reading of scripture right and making sure that we understand where christ is and how we can see christ in all the scripture but when we're talking about natural law i i don't want to uh repackage that in terms of covenant and i don't want to repackage that in terms of some type of christological reading of scripture I want to get after what is natural about natural law.
And so when we talk about what is natural about natural law, I think what we want to talk about is what one philosopher, David Orterberg, I think has helpfully described as the laws of natures.
And that's helpful because it forces us to take a step back We think of natural law often and rightly as something dealing with morality and that's true and good But I don't want to I feel like it's important for us not to confine the conversation to morality It actually takes a step back and it's about metaphysics and the relationship between morality and metaphysics And that these two things aren't disassociated from one another That's that's important So we're talking about the laws of natures.
We're asking questions like what are the laws that govern a seahorse in terms of its reproduction? male seahorses hold on to their children, right? And then they release the children.
Yeah, I mean, there's going to be different ways of discussing natural law and what people think it is.
There's a lot of individuals who I'm grateful for that write on natural law, especially in the evangelical tradition, who I would disagree with on how to formulate these things precisely.
But you made the comment about, is it Roman? I just want to say natural law is...
Like we have to, we want to remember that, you know, that Augustine was one who was willing to talk about eternal law, natural law, divine law, and human law.
And you see him doing that in his writings, but it's not even really Augustinian.
And so you can find it in Aristotle, right? You can go back to some of these great philosophers and see these seeds of natural law present.
Does it come to maybe a full flower in the time of the medieval ages from Augustine up into someone like Thomas Aquinas? Sure.
By the time you get to the Reformation, are there those who are holding to various versions of it? Are there differences about how we conceive of our relationship to God and the obligation that we owe to God and what grounds maybe the goodness and the obligation that's present? Yeah, there's differences, but I think there is a good grounding there.
in the reformed tradition but not just the reformed tradition because again i want to say this is this is more of a christian thing right um and it's not even uniquely christian because again people like aristotle are going to be able to to hold to it so what is it we're referring to when we refer to this thing that's natural law when i'm when i'm going after natural law i want to have like a very robust understanding of nature as such I don't want to develop an account of natural law that is really a repackaged version of covenantal law.
Do I think covenants are extremely important? Yeah, I mean, like you said, we were just on a few weeks ago talking about Baptist covenant theology.
um i'm a pastor i open the text regularly for my congregation um 80 90 times a year and walk through the texts and the covenants and explain all these things um so i care about those things i care about a christological reading of scripture right and making sure that we understand where christ is and how we can see christ in all the scripture but when we're talking about natural law i i don't want to uh repackage that in terms of covenant and i don't want to repackage that in terms of some type of christological reading of scripture I want to get after what is natural about natural law.
And so when we talk about what is natural about natural law, I think what we want to talk about is what one philosopher, David Orterberg, I think has helpfully described as the laws of natures.
And that's helpful because it forces us to take a step back We think of natural law often and rightly as something dealing with morality and that's true and good But I don't want to I feel like it's important for us not to confine the conversation to morality It actually takes a step back and it's about metaphysics and the relationship between morality and metaphysics And that these two things aren't disassociated from one another That's that's important So we're talking about the laws of natures.
We're asking questions like what are the laws that govern a seahorse in terms of its reproduction? male seahorses hold on to their children, right? And then they release the children.
The rest of this transcript — segmented and speaker-labeled, so you land on the exact moment something was said
Search every transcript — by keyword, by phrase, or by meaning, across every show Radar indexes
Trends — what is surging across podcasts, measured against its own baseline
Alerts — when a name you follow appears in a newly indexed episode
No account is needed to search Radar.
