Sep 17, 2026 · 45 min · 11 segments
Three decades ago, the CIA and French intelligence secretly collaborated to arrest and render Carlos the Jackal — the Venezuelan-born Marxist who became the world's most notorious terrorist — from his…
Joby WarrickGuest
Jay SolomonHostHagar ChemaliHost
Can you talk a bit more about the ideology? Because that's something that really fascinated me about the book.
Carlos, like you said, and many of the supporters of the Palestinian cause back then were leftists.
And like there's this convergence between the far left and the Islamists and the Arab nationalists that took place.
It seems on the one hand, pretty unique, but it also seems like it's recycling itself.
I just remember all those interesting groups from the 70s and the 80s, the Red Brigades, the Japanese Red Army, which you write about in the book.
Joby, if you could really emphasize, because this is not well understood by the broader public, even though it has lasted for decades, this this convergence between the far left and Islamists, because on its surface, it doesn't seem like it would be a natural thing.
a natural alliance given some of the the more radical liberal ideas that the far left pushes but it has been a constant over the decades yeah so really if you could really explain it for the for a public that really doesn't know why they're why they are often allied together
The reason this convergence, this sort of ideological convergence takes place, there are several reasons, but one is this was not a religious fight.
Wadi Haddad, this terrorist planner of the PFLP, was in fact a paid Soviet agent.
Very, very deep ties with sort of the global politics far left with the Marxist of the world, in fact.
And so there was this kind of ideological kinship that took place at a fundamental level.
And there was a surge of far left ideology that was fueled by the war in Vietnam, a belief that sort of capitalism was a corrosive force that needed to be checked.
Can you talk a bit more about the ideology? Because that's something that really fascinated me about the book.
Carlos, like you said, and many of the supporters of the Palestinian cause back then were leftists.
And like there's this convergence between the far left and the Islamists and the Arab nationalists that took place.
It seems on the one hand, pretty unique, but it also seems like it's recycling itself.
I just remember all those interesting groups from the 70s and the 80s, the Red Brigades, the Japanese Red Army, which you write about in the book.
Joby, if you could really emphasize, because this is not well understood by the broader public, even though it has lasted for decades, this this convergence between the far left and Islamists, because on its surface, it doesn't seem like it would be a natural thing.
a natural alliance given some of the the more radical liberal ideas that the far left pushes but it has been a constant over the decades yeah so really if you could really explain it for the for a public that really doesn't know why they're why they are often allied together
The reason this convergence, this sort of ideological convergence takes place, there are several reasons, but one is this was not a religious fight.
Wadi Haddad, this terrorist planner of the PFLP, was in fact a paid Soviet agent.
Very, very deep ties with sort of the global politics far left with the Marxist of the world, in fact.
And so there was this kind of ideological kinship that took place at a fundamental level.
And there was a surge of far left ideology that was fueled by the war in Vietnam, a belief that sort of capitalism was a corrosive force that needed to be checked.
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