Oct 14, 2026 · 54 min · 10 segments
My guest today is Dr. Yael Schonbrun is a clinical psychologist, couples therapist, author, and assistant professor at Brown University. She is the co-host of the *Psychologists Off the Clock* podcast…
So one of those first points that you made around overconfidence I thought was really interesting and is so real once you look at things through that lens, and if you have some humility [laughs] to own it.
Yeah, and it seems, maybe you could explain that, what that means a little bit more.
And also a takeaway was our overconfidence in understanding seems to go up the closer we are to somebody, and I thought that was really interesting.
Even in relationships after knowing someone for a long time, we seem to make a lot more assumptions and be way more confident in our understanding.
When you first start working with a client and you have such a clean beginner's mind on what you know about this person and building the map, and how over time you can...
And so it's maybe we could talk about that a little bit too, but let's showing up for you around building some texture around this overconfidence issue.
So just most fundamentally, like we do have more confidence in understanding than accuracy.
And when researchers have participants make ambiguous statements, they feel more certain that the listener will understand, and the listener feels more certain that they understood than they actually do.
And a pocket of research that you're referencing is research out of Nick Epley at the University of Chicago's [laughs] lab, which I just think is so cool.
He studies something called the closeness communication bias, and that's this idea that, as you're saying, like the more we know people, the more confident we get that we understand them.
So one of those first points that you made around overconfidence I thought was really interesting and is so real once you look at things through that lens, and if you have some humility [laughs] to own it.
Yeah, and it seems, maybe you could explain that, what that means a little bit more.
And also a takeaway was our overconfidence in understanding seems to go up the closer we are to somebody, and I thought that was really interesting.
Even in relationships after knowing someone for a long time, we seem to make a lot more assumptions and be way more confident in our understanding.
When you first start working with a client and you have such a clean beginner's mind on what you know about this person and building the map, and how over time you can...
And so it's maybe we could talk about that a little bit too, but let's showing up for you around building some texture around this overconfidence issue.
So just most fundamentally, like we do have more confidence in understanding than accuracy.
And when researchers have participants make ambiguous statements, they feel more certain that the listener will understand, and the listener feels more certain that they understood than they actually do.
And a pocket of research that you're referencing is research out of Nick Epley at the University of Chicago's [laughs] lab, which I just think is so cool.
He studies something called the closeness communication bias, and that's this idea that, as you're saying, like the more we know people, the more confident we get that we understand them.
The rest of this transcript — segmented and speaker-labeled, so you land on the exact moment something was said
Search every transcript — by keyword, by phrase, or by meaning, across every show Radar indexes
Trends — what is surging across podcasts, measured against its own baseline
Alerts — when a name you follow appears in a newly indexed episode
No account is needed to search Radar.