John Ryan, "America's Trial"

Um, let me take a, a shot at this and see what you think.

Um, any time in this process, have you heard people step back from it and say, "This has been ridiculous.

This has cost half billion dollars a year.

It's taken 25 years.

In the end, these people aren't gonna be released.

The families aren't getting what they deserve.

What's the point?"

Absolutely.

You know, we, we-- You do hear that a lot, and that's actually one of the- One of the reasons why it's great when newcomers go to Gitmo, including members of the media who maybe haven't been before, because sometimes I will ask these really detailed questions about, "Well, what does this motion mean?" Or, "Why did you ask this witness this question?" Right? I'm sort of in the weeds of it.

My, in my book, I certainly try to take big picture viewpoints, but I'm often in the weeds, and then someone else will come in and be like, "What is going on here? Why are you arguing over this one point for another year in court?" It's crazy.

And yes, I mean, that we, we hear that a lot.

It's a valid point of view.

I think that is what went into the prosecution's, the, the prosecution team's interest in having plea deals, right? We've been at this a long time.

It's moving so slowly.

Yeah, it's gonna be traumatic for some people to hear that KSM is not gonna be eligible for a death penalty and that there's not gonna be a full trial, but we really need to wrap this up.

It's the only way out.

I think the, the, the plea deals were a r- kind of a, a recognition of the absurdity in some ways, that this, this can't keep happening.

I- is there any doubt in your mind that the CIA tortured these people?

No.

I think if you look, if you read the, the summary of the Senate program, uh, the, the, the Senate summary of the CIA program, and there's been some parts of inspector general reports by the CIA that have been released, and then cables and other information that come out in court, including witness testimony.

Uh, no, I think it's clearly torture.

I...

You know what I say to people if, if you take these descriptions and say that a US service member was treated this way, or a US contractor captured overseas was treated this way, we would call it torture without thinking twice.

Um, in the 9/11 case, the most recent prior judge suppressed the confessions of one of the defendants made to the FBI in light of the torture that happened before.

He called it torture, uh, in his ruling.