Sep 22, 2026 · 42 min · 13 segments
How can water help us think differently about place, policy and public service reform? In this episode of Placecast, presenter Nicola Headlam is joined by Deryck Irving from the University of Stirling…
Having been a citizen connector, but also having a strong background in ecology.
So those two things, obviously, it's slightly sort of citizen science, but more citizen engaging with policies.
Working to connect policymakers, those who are tasked with implementing policy and those who are impacted by policy.
My background is much more governance of economic development, but I am slightly fascinated by the governing as if the watershed was a real unit in general.
I think certainly in the English context, if you look at the ways in which the water drains in the hydrology system, it can give you a really fascinating, so partly my work's about institutions that are missing in the middle, you know.
And I've always found incredibly useful as a method, like fluvial governance, like imagine if we were able to govern ourselves as if the watershed were a real thing.
And I find it really fascinating because it's almost like ecology and water management.
It becomes like such a powerful metaphor for the ways in which Things can pool and flow.
And it's amazing how many of the terms that we lift, really, isn't it, from your kind of area of work?
It's also remarkable the moment you start working in water, which I did about five years ago, you suddenly find that every single conversation you're having to apologise for the unintended pun that you've used, whether it's ripples or pooling or...
We chose our geography based on a large river system that was closely adjacent to the central university in the partnership.
But we've chosen a geography that isn't associated with any one of the stakeholders, which means that if you start to talk to people about something, the first thing that most bodies and individuals will do is they'll try and point at whose job it is.
Oh, that's the council's job, or that's Scottish Water's job, or that's SEPA's job.
And actually the catchment as we've selected it really doesn't overlap with any of those.
Everyone is having to think slightly differently and to think about connections and up and downstream impacts in a way that perhaps would be skipped if we were to say, right, well, let's look at Sterling as a council area, or let's look at southeast scotland as an area that's currently covered for climate resilience i think getting people to think in a place geography that isn't the standard one that they've addressed is always really interesting
i couldn't agree more and i think partly that is what the element of surprise in a way is the bit that helps to shake people out of well this is my green and blue planning for this i am the lead on it it is a because space is never contained it doesn't matter we pretend it is of course but That's why I think it's quite interesting from a, as an imaginary, waters are kind of, they do bring imagination, don't they, to the piece in a sense.
Having been a citizen connector, but also having a strong background in ecology.
So those two things, obviously, it's slightly sort of citizen science, but more citizen engaging with policies.
Working to connect policymakers, those who are tasked with implementing policy and those who are impacted by policy.
My background is much more governance of economic development, but I am slightly fascinated by the governing as if the watershed was a real unit in general.
I think certainly in the English context, if you look at the ways in which the water drains in the hydrology system, it can give you a really fascinating, so partly my work's about institutions that are missing in the middle, you know.
And I've always found incredibly useful as a method, like fluvial governance, like imagine if we were able to govern ourselves as if the watershed were a real thing.
And I find it really fascinating because it's almost like ecology and water management.
It becomes like such a powerful metaphor for the ways in which Things can pool and flow.
And it's amazing how many of the terms that we lift, really, isn't it, from your kind of area of work?
It's also remarkable the moment you start working in water, which I did about five years ago, you suddenly find that every single conversation you're having to apologise for the unintended pun that you've used, whether it's ripples or pooling or...
We chose our geography based on a large river system that was closely adjacent to the central university in the partnership.
But we've chosen a geography that isn't associated with any one of the stakeholders, which means that if you start to talk to people about something, the first thing that most bodies and individuals will do is they'll try and point at whose job it is.
Oh, that's the council's job, or that's Scottish Water's job, or that's SEPA's job.
And actually the catchment as we've selected it really doesn't overlap with any of those.
Everyone is having to think slightly differently and to think about connections and up and downstream impacts in a way that perhaps would be skipped if we were to say, right, well, let's look at Sterling as a council area, or let's look at southeast scotland as an area that's currently covered for climate resilience i think getting people to think in a place geography that isn't the standard one that they've addressed is always really interesting
i couldn't agree more and i think partly that is what the element of surprise in a way is the bit that helps to shake people out of well this is my green and blue planning for this i am the lead on it it is a because space is never contained it doesn't matter we pretend it is of course but That's why I think it's quite interesting from a, as an imaginary, waters are kind of, they do bring imagination, don't they, to the piece in a sense.
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