Sep 16, 2026 · 42 min · 10 segments
Many conversations about development for focus on aid: how much, from whom, and for how long. But aid has never been more than a small part of what pays for a country's development, and in 2025 it…
Alexia LatortueGuest
Radha RajkotiaGuestTim PhillipsHostAlexia, included in these liabilities are things like unsustainable debt, which is part of the system by which lending is done, conflict, climate change.
But if we don't discover, rediscover that global will to try and address what are global problems in the end, does this undermine any development strategy that you're gonna come up with?

So they are global problems, Tim, but I think it's important to also say there are also opportunities.

So as Radha was saying, debt is not a bad word, and actually if we turn it into a bad word, it will limit countries.

And actually, when we talk about debt, we really need to think about the price, and that's really some of it has hurt many countries that are in trouble.

Sometimes it's endogenous behavior and, and mismanagement, but sometimes it's also around exogenous shocks and pricing of capital, particularly for many countries on the African continent that has just been too exorbitant, and I think there's now work happening to sort of address these challenges.

And then is there a real investment plan that makes sense where there will be returns to help repay the debt? And so I think a lot of ex ante upfront work needs to be done and much more attention needs to be done around what are the investment needs of countries, what are the different instruments that countries can then meet those investment needs and really reframe thinking about debt in an investment context would be my first point.

But it's true that when it comes to countries that are near debt distress, so perhaps really facing liquidity issues, or countries that are in debt distress, the current system has not kept up.

It has not kept up with the changing characteristics and composition of that debt.

Some of the greatest creditors are countries that are not members of the Paris Club, the place where debt restructuring has happened in the past, including China, more and more now some of the countries in the Gulf.

And so we need an inclusive place for all actors, both sovereign and commercial, to be able to work on debt resolution issues in the same sequence at the same time to try and align incentives.

So there's a lot of work that requires some political will and perhaps some more inclusive for us for the conversation.

We all know, I think we've, in so many parts of the world, have been through major heatwaves across the world or floods, and of course, the most vulnerable country and the most vulnerable people in all countries are at the greatest risk of these impacts.

We need to think of climate and sustainable development as absolutely intertwined.

Right now, those communities can be quite siloed and work not just in parallel, which is bad enough, but they don't recognize that finding sustainable solutions require understanding that climate and development are absolutely intimately linked.

Particularly for the most vulnerable countries, the issue is adaptation, and adaptation is good development.

If you build a road that cannot survive a typhoon, that is more costly, certainly financially, but importantly also to the people that can't get to the hospital, for example-
Alexia, included in these liabilities are things like unsustainable debt, which is part of the system by which lending is done, conflict, climate change.
But if we don't discover, rediscover that global will to try and address what are global problems in the end, does this undermine any development strategy that you're gonna come up with?

So they are global problems, Tim, but I think it's important to also say there are also opportunities.

So as Radha was saying, debt is not a bad word, and actually if we turn it into a bad word, it will limit countries.

And actually, when we talk about debt, we really need to think about the price, and that's really some of it has hurt many countries that are in trouble.

Sometimes it's endogenous behavior and, and mismanagement, but sometimes it's also around exogenous shocks and pricing of capital, particularly for many countries on the African continent that has just been too exorbitant, and I think there's now work happening to sort of address these challenges.

And then is there a real investment plan that makes sense where there will be returns to help repay the debt? And so I think a lot of ex ante upfront work needs to be done and much more attention needs to be done around what are the investment needs of countries, what are the different instruments that countries can then meet those investment needs and really reframe thinking about debt in an investment context would be my first point.

But it's true that when it comes to countries that are near debt distress, so perhaps really facing liquidity issues, or countries that are in debt distress, the current system has not kept up.

It has not kept up with the changing characteristics and composition of that debt.

Some of the greatest creditors are countries that are not members of the Paris Club, the place where debt restructuring has happened in the past, including China, more and more now some of the countries in the Gulf.

And so we need an inclusive place for all actors, both sovereign and commercial, to be able to work on debt resolution issues in the same sequence at the same time to try and align incentives.

So there's a lot of work that requires some political will and perhaps some more inclusive for us for the conversation.

We all know, I think we've, in so many parts of the world, have been through major heatwaves across the world or floods, and of course, the most vulnerable country and the most vulnerable people in all countries are at the greatest risk of these impacts.

We need to think of climate and sustainable development as absolutely intertwined.

Right now, those communities can be quite siloed and work not just in parallel, which is bad enough, but they don't recognize that finding sustainable solutions require understanding that climate and development are absolutely intimately linked.

Particularly for the most vulnerable countries, the issue is adaptation, and adaptation is good development.

If you build a road that cannot survive a typhoon, that is more costly, certainly financially, but importantly also to the people that can't get to the hospital, for example-
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