The Conditions for Recovery Podcast: Hope, Agency and Chronic Illness
Sep 1, 2026 · 46 min · 10 segments
"When you live with pain, the first thing you want is your pain gone. The pain might lessen, it might not but let’s figure out how to get back into life and have that energy." In this episode of The…
Amber KyliukGuest
George DowswellHost
I think what you said about the body keeps the score is something that's worth revisiting.

Because firstly, I think actually in some ways, it sounds like you had some pretty good friends and mentors to put you on to some of the things that you were put onto.

And I don't know how long that took or where in your journey those things came about.

But actually, I regularly don't recommend the body keeps the score to people, even when I feel like it might be relevant to them because of what you said before.

Feels like sometimes it's more descriptive than it needs to be was my feeling when I was reading it.

And I think that there's a huge amount of value in it, but also it can be off-putting for people.

You have to already have a reasonable understanding of how long-term conditions impact people for it to feel fully relevant rather than just to take everything that's said in it at face value.

And I like to think we're past this phase, but there's this initial message that healthcare practitioners who are just learning about pain science start giving the message that pain is in your brain, right? And it starts to feel like there's that same connection of putting the onus on the person who has the pain of saying, pains in your brain, you've now created this situation where you're living with persistent pain.

And when I work with people, the last message I want them to feel they're walking away with is that it's their fault, right? Because it's not their fault that they're living in pain.

So I'm going to start thinking of all these things and letting it weigh me down.

You're so right that a huge amount of the protocolization and oversimplification of the messages that are delivered in pain management can very easily be interpreted as victim blaming.

And the other thing I personally think that pain is in the brain was and is a fairly giant misstep in terms of, well, hang on a minute.

are useless lumps of tissue without the person that is attached to that brain.

And all of those things are both acting on and being acted on by their environment.

I think what you said about the body keeps the score is something that's worth revisiting.

Because firstly, I think actually in some ways, it sounds like you had some pretty good friends and mentors to put you on to some of the things that you were put onto.

And I don't know how long that took or where in your journey those things came about.

But actually, I regularly don't recommend the body keeps the score to people, even when I feel like it might be relevant to them because of what you said before.

Feels like sometimes it's more descriptive than it needs to be was my feeling when I was reading it.

And I think that there's a huge amount of value in it, but also it can be off-putting for people.

You have to already have a reasonable understanding of how long-term conditions impact people for it to feel fully relevant rather than just to take everything that's said in it at face value.

And I like to think we're past this phase, but there's this initial message that healthcare practitioners who are just learning about pain science start giving the message that pain is in your brain, right? And it starts to feel like there's that same connection of putting the onus on the person who has the pain of saying, pains in your brain, you've now created this situation where you're living with persistent pain.

And when I work with people, the last message I want them to feel they're walking away with is that it's their fault, right? Because it's not their fault that they're living in pain.

So I'm going to start thinking of all these things and letting it weigh me down.

You're so right that a huge amount of the protocolization and oversimplification of the messages that are delivered in pain management can very easily be interpreted as victim blaming.

And the other thing I personally think that pain is in the brain was and is a fairly giant misstep in terms of, well, hang on a minute.

are useless lumps of tissue without the person that is attached to that brain.

And all of those things are both acting on and being acted on by their environment.
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