EMT #65 with Dax Callner and Chris Kappes - Building the Future of Event Measurement

Event marketers have believed in the power of face-to-face experiences for decades. But as budgets grow and leadership asks tougher questions about marketing spend, belief alone is no longer enough. In Episode 65 of **Event Marketer’s Toolbox**, hosts Chris Dunn **and** Dana Esposito sit down with Dax Callner, Founder and President of the Event Marketing Measurement Association (EMMA), and Christopher Kappes, EMMA Board Member and longtime event industry leader, to tackle a challenge the industry has struggled with for decades: how do we consistently and credibly prove the business value of events? The conversation goes beyond simply calculating ROI. Dax and Christopher discuss why event measurement needs shared standards, how marketers can measure the potential they create rather than taking responsibility for sales that happen months or years later, what the industry can learn from unsuccessful events, and how EMMA is working to make measurement knowledge accessible to everyone.  **1. Believing in Events Is No Longer Enough** Events are an expensive marketing channel, and the people controlling budgets are increasingly asking marketers to demonstrate why that investment is worthwhile. Dax explains that measurement serves two purposes. First, it provides credible evidence that helps defend event investment. Second, it gives marketers the information they need to continuously improve their programs. Knowing what worked—and what didn't—allows teams to make changes and show stakeholders how those changes affected performance.  **2. The Industry Needs a Common Measurement Language** One of the reasons event measurement remains difficult is that organizations, agencies, and suppliers often use their own methodologies. EMMA wants to establish a shared foundation. What began around 2017 as a group of experienced practitioners working through the measurement problem has evolved into a nonprofit organization focused on three areas: **standards, advocacy, and education**. EMMA's goal isn't to prevent agencies or brands from developing their own approaches. It's to establish fundamentals that the entire industry can understand and use, making credible measurement knowledge more accessible instead of keeping it behind agency walls.  **3. Measure the Potential Your Event Creates** One of the most practical distinctions in the episode is between **event-generated potential and eventual closed revenue**. Dax shares an example from his work measuring automotive events. By examining buying signals, lead qualification, and other indicators, the team could project millions of dollars in potential revenue generated by an event. That distinction matters because the event team doesn't necessarily control what happens six months or a year later. Sales teams, dealerships, and other parts of the organization are responsible for converting those opportunities. For event marketers, the job is to understand and demonstrate the quality and value of the potential being handed back to the business.  **4. Bad Results Are Still Valuable Data** Measurement isn't only useful when an event performs well. The conversation includes an example where an event didn't deliver the expected results. Instead of hiding the problem, the team used the data to identify what went wrong and explain how they would fix it. That transparency ultimately strengthened the client relationship and led to additional work. As Dana points out during the discussion, failures provide information that can make future events better. Measurement gives teams the evidence to understand those failures instead of relying on assumptions.  **5. Better Measurement Requires Better Industry Transparency** Measurement also raises a larger question about the relationship between exhibitors and show organizers. Christopher discusses the difficulty exhibitors sometimes face getting clear information about who is attending an event. Without accurate audience information, brands have a harder time evaluating whether they're reaching the right people and whether an event deserves continued investment. The group argues that better measurement can create healthier conversations between organizers and exhibitors. If an event consistently fails to deliver the audience exhibitors need, continuing to invest without addressing the problem isn't sustainable.  **6. EMMA Is Building Education, Benchmarks, and Standards for What's Next** A major part of EMMA's next chapter is education. The organization is developing a comprehensive event measurement certification program with 13 modules, designed to give event professionals hands-on measurement training. EMMA is also working toward a benchmark database that would aggregate anonymized industry data, allowing marketers to better understand what "good" performance actually looks like.  Another planned research initiative will examine the **long-tail impact of events** by reconnecting with attendees six and twelve months later to understand what they actually did after an experience: whether perceptions changed, purchases happened, loyalty increased, or other behaviors followed.  The larger goal is to give the industry a credible source of truth rather than forcing every marketer to solve measurement independently. For years, event professionals have known intuitively that face-to-face experiences create value. But intuition becomes much harder to defend when budgets are scrutinized and every marketing channel is expected to demonstrate performance. The opportunity isn't simply to find a better ROI formula. It's to build a more consistent approach to defining objectives, measuring behaviors and perceptions, understanding attendee value, learning from failures, and communicating event impact in language the rest of the business understands. EMMA's work toward shared standards, accessible education, certification, benchmarks, and long-term research could help give event professionals a stronger foundation for doing exactly that. And as Dax emphasizes near the end of the episode, measurement doesn't necessarily require a massive budget—there are economical and even free ways to start collecting better evidence.  🎧 **Listen to the full episode of Event Marketer's Toolbox to hear Dax Callner, Christopher Kappes, Chris Dunn, and Dana Esposito explore what better event measurement could mean for marketers, exhibitors, agencies, and the industry as a whole.** If measurement is still the part of your event strategy that gets pushed to "later," this conversation is a good place to start changing that. 👉🏼 *Join us for more insightful discussions like this by tuning into 'Event Marketer's Toolbox,' where industry leaders share the tools, tactics, and trends driving success in the event world.* This Show is sponsored by Blue Hive  📅 Join us LIVE every Thursday at 12 PM ET on LinkedIn Follow Us on LinkedIn and YouTube Subscribe to our Newsletter!