What does healthy masculinity look like? | Andrew Reiner

One quick stat, and then maybe a last question on masculinity, but I do want to get to the idea of connection and relationships and some more things that you've found in your book.

But so we put out a report at Sutherland called Missing Anchors, where we surveyed men nationwide and in Utah about various self-reported metrics of mental health and well-being connection.

We found that only about a quarter of men in Utah believe that there is a good definition of healthy masculinity in society today.

And it's more than that on the national level.

It's about half.

I'm not sure why there's that difference between Utah and nationally, but The thing I want to ask you is because it seems like so many these days are scrambling for what is a good definition of masculinity that is healthy and constructive and true today? I'll borrow from Richard Reeves again because I heard him give part of this answer and then connect it to what you were saying earlier about kind of the more toxic spaces of the internet where – If masculinity is defined in the self that, well, I have to be strong or emotionally regulated or powerful for me, that's maybe the selfish, immature version of masculinity.

Whereas if I aspire to certain attributes, again, within healthy bounds, for other people, as in what is my responsibility to my wife and children, to my coworkers, to my neighbors, to my fellow countrymen, Essentially, this idea that a core piece of masculinity is my responsibility to other people by virtue of my relationships with them, almost trying to move toward a selflessness that I want to be the best version of me, not just because it makes me feel cool as a man, but because that empowers me and equips me to bless the lives of others and serve others.

How do you respond to that component of at least a foundation for a true healthy definition of masculinity today?

I mean, I think that that absolutely is something that we need to be leaning into more as we're working, raising and or working with boys and young men.

And a big reason for that, Nick, is that one of the other messages that a lot of boys and young men get through a lot of the influencers they follow is about the idea of wealth.

And it's the idea that wealth, accumulating wealth, building wealth is another way through this kind of mass consumption that you show your masculinity.

That is becoming increasingly more and more.

That's another metric, another way that you can enter into that.

And it's a way that you can prove your masculinity.

So when we talk about a lot of these issues, especially the things like spending a lot of time focusing on your body because that's going to give you – that's going to validate your identity and your worth.

When you spend a lot of time working to build and accumulate wealth because that's going to validate your worth and your identity, these are things that just encourage solipsism.

It's just encouraging more and more of that kind of focus only on the self.

And so the idea of looking outside of ourselves and understanding that we have a commitment to other people in our schools, as you mentioned, in our jobs, in other parts of our community, that is only gonna build resiliency.

Really what we're talking about here at the end of the day, Nick, for my money is resiliency.

And there's a dearth of resiliency in a lot of boys and young men.

It's really one of the big focuses of my next book.

And when I think that when we get outside of ourselves, we start to really, not only do we grow, but I think there's a type of strength that develops within that, that type of commitment, that type of accountability that I think is really lost today.

And I think that that one way that we can really start to get boys and young men to understand the importance of getting beyond themselves and to understand the value of giving back, we have to start small.

We can't just say, this is really important.

You need to do this because that's not going to be enough of a sell for a lot of boys and young men.