Mm-hmm.

And you have to ask yourself why they do that.

And, you know, I, I think that w- there was a bit of a myth around that.

I mean, I would love, you know, we hear about the stories about Tip O'Neill and Ronald Reagan.

It's a bit before either of our time periods, so it's hard to remember that.

But, you know, I, I think that we have seen, you know, frankly, Republicans, in 2002, the Max Cleland ads, where they basically tried to tie him to Osama Bin Laden, and it worked.

And he lost his seat.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah

... on that.

And I think that, uh, there are still some elements on our side that are trying to run campaigns like they were in 2008 or 2004.

That just doesn't work anymore, and I think that, um, you know, uh, one of the things, and I'm, I don't want to give him any credit, but, you know, one of the reasons that Donald Trump made inroads with Black Americans, and we spoke to this guy, uh, uh, Mike from Black Men Vote, and then we asked him, it's like, "Well, why did he make so many inroads?" And he was like, "Well, one, he went into these communities and, like, paid influencers to create content for him," so he was putting money into the hands of people who needed it, and then he created allies who then were basically in, quote-unquote, enemy territory, and he was, he, like, whittled the votes away a little bit.

The other thing-

Yeah

... that I think we're really bad at is that, you know, we've, I understand why we do it because I agree, but, like, healthcare for example, we say, "Well, it's a human right." But what we should be doing is talking about how healthcare, we, one, yes, that is true, but also it would be the largest economic stimulus that this country has ever had because how many people would quit their jobs and try their startup if they knew that their family had healthcare? And the answer is a lot, and especially in Black and Latino, uh, communities where, uh, you know, those communities are very entrepreneur-focused.

Uh, they want to build businesses for th- you know, they have always struggled to, you know, with systemic racism to compete for the same high-level jobs as other people.

What was the Electric Drive Transportation Association that you managed to spend almost four years of your life at?

So that is still to this day a trade association for both the auto industry and the electric utility industry to promote the development and advancement of battery electric hybrid and fuel cell vehicles.

So obviously for the auto manufacturers, they wanted incentives to build cars and incentives for people to buy them like we have or at least used to have.

And on the electric utility side, helping to fund electric vehicle charging infrastructure because obviously they want to sell electricity.

So it was like six people there because I was the youngest.

I was they were like here.

You take the website.

What'd you like and what'd you not like?

Is that why she's been so hard to defeat? Does that reputation as independent resonate that strongly with Maine voters? A hundred percent.

Yes.

And I think she has really cultivated this myth over the past 30 years.

And the thing that I always say to people when they say she's independent, I'm like, tell me one time that she was the deciding vote to vote something down from a Republican president.

And the answer is they can't do it because she jumps on to bills that don't have a chance of passing so that she can say that.

she's a moderate and you know she claims to be pro-choice but that went out the window when she voted for brett kavanaugh on the supreme court so she either uh she either was just closing her eyes and hoping it would go away or she really doesn't have a read on these people either way i find that that's disqualifying to be senator from the state and she has voted consistently with donald trump over and over again and even when we saw with this horrific ice murder in biddeford last week she doesn't have much to say about it at all and i think mainers are furious that we don't have shootings like this we don't have federal agents coming in and shooting and killing people who they weren't even targeting so i think that alone has really gotten people even more frustrated with her and i think this is a completely different election than she's ever faced

Are there other weaknesses you think that exist in Senator Collins's support that might not have existed before?

Yeah.

Correct.

And, um, and so, I wanna turn ...

Uh, so I think everybody on this call probably would prefer our, uh, our new, next guest to actually be the President of the United States at this moment.

We have Martin Sheen, who has, I think, played a president twice and has been a chief of staff once, and actually has been, I believe, arrested more times than Donald Trump, but for very good reasons, uh, standing up for what's right.

So, uh, Martin Sheen, thank you.

It is an honor to speak to you and we'd love to hear from you about why, why voting Yes on Prop 50 is so important.

Yes.

Well, well said.

Yeah.

Well, I think, you know, we, we had a lot of success, uh, last fall with the White Dudes for Harris.

Uh, but obviously we started in like August, so there wasn't a lot of time.

But what we found was that there are a lot of people who look like us, who are very, very, were very, very interested and engaged with electing Kamala Harris as the next president.

And those people haven't gone away and neither have we, but we have basically transitioned to this podcast so that we could keep these conversations going and keep talking to these people and let them know that there is space within the Democratic Party for them.

And we know just from the numbers out there, like we need more men on the Democratic side in order to win elections.

And so we were sort of trying to be a place for, for men and anybody to come and have these conversations.

Sure.