What do people who haven't experienced a challenge firsthand misunderstand about what happens behind the scenes, and how did your community support you through that process?

Um, a couple of things.

First, I'm not sure that, um, the average person, especially the average person who's tempted to challenge a book, understands how costly it is.

Um, every title that was challenged in my district cost the district at least sixteen hundred dollars in terms of time and materials that were devoted, uh, diverted, excuse me, away from serving students.

Um, so it's a huge waste of money, uh, especially for some, you know, it tends to be done in a knee-jerk, rather frivolous way.

Um, and, you know, it's-- totally stops the train.

Uh, so that's, you know-- If people knew that, perhaps they would think twice about it.

Right

But I'm so happy that we participated because I think better than little snip snippets on social media, having the full story put together that really helps people be dig in and understand it in a deeper way really is the best way to change hearts and minds so I'm so glad that we did it and along the way in our work we connected with Martha and saw what was happening to her and other people who are in the film and so so we built this little network of people over time but I'll pitch it to Martha and see how she got involved

thanks Carolyn um My involvement in this issue writ large started on September 28th, 2021.

And if you've been following the timeline, that's when a group of parents showed up at the board meeting to attack those books you mentioned and also, by the way, to attack me.

September 28th, 2021 made me one of the first librarians in the country to be so targeted.

I mean, that's even before the Krauss list came out.

So I started scrambling right away to defend the library, the books, the kids and myself.

And it was a very lonely experience.

So I would love to just know what the student reaction has been, especially for, you know, Martha and Carolyn that are still in libraries, what you've heard from your students and yeah, how you feel about the way, how they're doing these days.

What happens when that normally occ- occurs, not in this circumstance, but normally a parent comes in and says, "Hey, I have a question about this book."

Right.

Uh, prior to, uh, 2021 certainly, that had happened a handful of times, uh, in my 20-year career as a high school librarian.

Uh, and before 2021, that always started with this ye old-fashioned thing called a conversation.

Uh, that's lacking in the current environment, but one parent would contact me or perhaps an English teacher or, or the principal to express a concern about the use of that book with their child.

The great thing about a conversation is that that parent can then explain their concerns and then, uh, I and/or the English teacher or the principal can then talk about, "Well, here's the value of this book.

Here's why it's in the library, what it contributes to the collection overall.

Really?

Exactly.

... to manipulate the perception of what's happening.

F- take, for example, a book like This Book is Gay, um, and you'll hear those who want it removed saying, "This should not be in a first grade classroom." I have wonderful news for you, it is not.

Um, s- so the, the, they're taking books intended for young adults and high school students, positioning them as being, uh, distributed, handed off, promoted to kindergartners and first graders and using that false frame, uh, to demonize librarians and the profession as a whole.

In watching the film, there are some pretty scary stuff that happens at a few of the meetings.

Um, were you ever in fear for your life, Martha? Um, I was definitely in fear.

Um, I don't know if it has gone so far as to be in fear for my life, um, but th- things did get to, uh, a point where I, uh, installed security cameras on my home.

(laughs)