What was your early start in policy?

So I was an academic.

You know, at first I wanted to be a school teacher.

And I had this favorite high school history teacher who I contacted when I was graduating college.

And I said, I'm thinking about being a history school teacher like you.

Like, I want to be like you.

And he said, don't do it.

its cause.

Mm-hmm.

Um, and, um, and so I think we helped demonstrate that.

And so we...

I mean, I entered the school choice movement, in a sense, um, at its very modern beginning.

Uh, the very first school choice program in modern era was passed in 1990 in Milwaukee.

Uh, and I conducted randomized evaluation of the Milwaukee program with Paul Peterson, who was my advisor at Harvard.

And, um, and since then I was kind of hooked on, on public policy research.

Hmm.

Jay, it's your turn.

Thanks for having me on the show.

Uh, it's wonderful talking with Daniel about these issues.

So let me first acknowledge that foreign students and staff contribute valuable skill, knowledge, and energy to US higher education.

Um, so they are beneficial.

But like with everything in public policy, it's a question of balance.

We have to balance that benefit against other, uh, risks and dangers that those people may pose.

You guys are both very passionate and informed about your topic, but, uh, I need to turn us to the closing statements, and in reverse order, that means Jay will go first for two minutes, and Daniel, you will have the final word.

Jay, it's your turn.

Thanks for having me on this show.

It's wonderful talking with Daniel about these issues.

So let me first acknowledge that foreign students and staff contribute valuable skill, knowledge, and energy to U.S. higher education.

So they are beneficial.

But like with everything in public policy, it's a question of balance.

We have to balance that benefit against other risks and dangers that those people may pose.

And in reverse order, that means Jay will go first for two minutes and Daniel, you will have the final word.