Can you tell us a little bit about that experience and being a part of that initial repeal process?

Yeah, when the initial repeal happened, I was very much behind the scenes, just coming to understand not only my identity, but what role I could play in this.

So when that happened, where the initial repeal was in 2016, We had a lot of people that were our allies out front leading the charge because they could be public.

And I'm talking about people like Sue Fulton and Alison Robinson, people who had seen what this discrimination looked like for themselves and didn't want it to occur for others.

And they led the charge after the end of Don't Ask, Don't Tell when a lot of people thought, great, we've fixed everything.

And trans people were still, hey, what about us? And it was these allies who came to our aid and said, we won't leave you behind.

Again, another very military concept.

And so to have you talk about the be vulnerable of not feeling like maybe I didn't do enough, I think that's something that a lot of people can resonate and appreciate hearing here.

You were, I think, the highest ranking, uh, uh, transgender person, but, uh, this is happening throughout the services, down through, through the officer ranks and the enlisted ranks, I suppose.

Yeah.

It is a process that is really just a kangaroo court, where people are guilty before any evidence is shown if there is no other outcome.

Because the orders have been passed down that if anyone ever had, uh, a diagnosis or symptoms of gender dysphoria, which is something the government required us to get in order to transition within the military, that they fall under this executive order and need to be kicked out, despite whatever evidence is offered.

And just this morning, in fact, I got a message from a major saying, "I just got identified.

My board is coming up.

Will you write me a letter of support?" And they're trying to get hundreds of these letters.

I mean, is that, am I wrong? With that did exist, and-

Thank you.

Trans people, I think, have become what I hope is the last boogeyman.

As we've picked any group of people and said, they are the problem.

They are the source of all of society's ills.

We've gone down through the years, over the decades of American history, picking smaller and smaller groups of people to blame.

Trans people are about 1% of the population.

We're about the same as the amount of redheaded people in the population.

And if you don't, I'm letting you know you should.

And just how was... how did that go? How did the military treat you? How did your colleagues take it? What, what lessons did we learn from that?

It, it was an experience that shocked me because (clears throat) I was in my first tour, uh, at the Pentagon.

I was a major at the time, and I knew the secretary of defense was gonna make the announcement that trans people could serve openly.

And when he finished speaking, I had an email ready to go to my colleagues and a Facebook post coming out to the world.

Because prior to that, had anyone known and that word got back to someone, I would have lost my career, uh, at that time 13 years, for something that had nothing to do with my ability to serve.

Uh, but he wrapped up, said, "As of now, trans folks can serve openly." Uh, I was a little afraid, uh, so I paused for a moment, and then hit send, uh, hit post, and ran away.

Uh, went to the gym buried underneath the Pentagon, got on the elliptical machine, and I went nowhere faster than I'd ever gone anywhere in my life, thinking, "How is my life going to be different?" Uh, but when I got back to my desk, I sat down.

But how many of you are there? What have your, what are your peers saying? Uh, wh- how are they behaving? What's, what's actually gonna happen?

I wonder if you could talk to us about how this feels to be there when this is happening and a little bit about what you see.

Well, it feels like there's a focus on short-term actions that could be considered as wins in some way by putting others down perhaps or- or focusing on things that are not connected to any sort of longer term strategy, this relentless focus on war fighting and how do we fight better than anyone else? In my mind, it's more about focusing on how do we not go to war?How do we be prepared in a way, how do we have the friends and alliances that matter in a way that no one would ever want to fight us, that we would never have to get to that point? So, that's one of the things that I wish we were doing is figuring out how do we lead in a way that others are going to want to follow us, that we're gonna wanna come together in some sort of shared purpose and ensure that we never have to fight.

'Cause it is not about being the biggest, baddest bully on the block, it's about having so many friends that you're untouchable.

And so that feeling that we're changing our focus can be really challenging to deal with, and also there's a bit of a culture of silence that has emerged, and that's really frightening as well, because our job is to provide best military advice, and if the advice or the only thing we can say is yes, that's problematic as well.

And we have historically been able to tap into multiple perspectives and build amazing solutions because we're listening to everyone, we're hearing from people of different backgrounds, different experiences, and integrating that into the solution that we need.

And if we are telling certain voices that you're not welcome, that your perspective is not warranted, then we have a problem.

I just- it seems like an anathema to what the military is now.

Well, I can't explain why this focus on destruction of the diversity that exists, uh, within our military.

Thank you.

I had an email ready to go to my colleagues, uh, and I had a- a Facebook post ready to go to come out to the world. But when he made the announcement, I hesitated because I didn't know how the world was going to change for me. And I took a moment, but eventually I got the courage to hit post, to hit send, and then I ran away. I found the gym buried underneath the Pentagon, I hopped on the elliptical machine and I went nowhere faster than I had ever gone anywhere in my life with all the nervous energy that I had, again wondering, "How is my life different now?" But I got back to my desk, I sat down, and the most amazing thing happened. One by one, my colleagues walked over to me, shook my hand, and said, "It's an honor to serve with you." And I was floored because the honor was all mine to serve with them. It was truly an amazing moment of the comradery that is built within the military and how being your authentic self can enhance unit cohesion. Uh, and though some people faced much different coming out stories, uh, by and large, that's the reception that transgender troops have received in the military because we've worked with the people around us for a long time. They know we have their backs, uh, and it is being ourselves that makes, again, for those better bonds of teamwork, not hiding who we are. Because if we're hiding who we are, that means we're spending a portion of our mental energy protecting our identity when instead, that could all be spent on either the mission or the relationships with the people around us.

Not long after that, of course, Trump reinstated the ban. Where did that leave you?

In 2017 when he initially tweeted, it actually took a while, uh, nearly 18 months before the Supreme Court allowed the government to put the policy in place due to all the legal challenges. But when it finally settled into place in April of 2019, there was a clause in the policy that allowed approximately 1,600 of us at the time that had come out, received a- a military diagnosis and began a transition process to continue serving. So, we became an endangered species at the time where no one new could come out, no one new could get in. What's different this time around is that it's that ban again, but it's also a purge. There are thousands more transgender service members out there than there were, uh, a decade ago, and this policy not only says no one new can come in, no one new can come out as trans, but all of you who are currently serving are no longer compatible with military service and are going to be administratively discharged. The government's position is that we fail to meet the rigorous mental or physical standards...... demanded of military service. But they don't provide any evidence, and we have thousands of service members who not only meet the standards, but in most cases, exceed them.