What do you mean by that? Yeah

...

so what it means by is by starting by listening to the people that you're trying to influence.

Um, you know, what is it that they care about? Really digging into why your project is going to be important for them.

Um, so it's walking in the shoes of our stakeholders, um, seeing what the world looks like through their eyes, and that's where our stories start.

Um, so I think, you know, that's the k- that's a, a stage that we so often miss out on, and I actually hear people go, "I don't have the time to do that." Well, you're never gonna connect with the people that you need to have on side if you don't have a sense of what matters to them.

So that's the most important sort of stage I say about creating stories, which often people overlook.

But on the flip side, do you have any advice on how to talk about failures or things that went wrong that you might actually personally find quite difficult to talk about, and you might feel a bit scared about kind of, you know, blame culture and that kind of stuff?