Uh, what, what first inspired your journey into wildlife conservation and research? Can you take us back? Because I'm sure a lot of people are interested to know how, how did you get yourself into, into doing what you, you, you do?

Okay, thank you for the question.

Um, indeed my journey was started very formally.

I, I started off as a wildlife, a research scientist in Kenya Wildlife Service, and, uh, like many of the young scientists, we spent a lot of time out in forests and counting elephants.

Those days we were trying to establish how many elephant we had left after many years of very intense poaching.

So in the savannahs, we used to count elephants using aeroplanes, and in the forests we would count dung piles.

So we were up to our heads in dung trying to estimate how many elephants were there.

Yeah.