Yeah

... people in the, the lead want, want to be.

Um, yeah, I mean, of course, like, uh, we really care about giving people access to information.

And so, like, it, it's almost like we're kind of enabling all the open source models to have a fantastic search engine, right? Like, every open source model, there's no open source search engine.

It's kind of, it doesn't make sense.

You could run, uh, a model, like, pretty cheaply on your laptop, but you can't run a search engine.

Uh, so you kind of need to use, uh, some search engine.

So when we go on tour, we're also hitting the play button like a DJ does.

Um, could you talk about the two or three different stages that have happened and what broke and what then changed in you?

A lot of it, by the way, has to do with physical office structure.

So like for example, when you're four people, you fit in a room.

And then a big stage that happens is when you can't fit in a room anymore.

[laughs] Like you just physically can't fit in one room.

Well, now there's an information... 'Cause a, a company is like a bunch of people sharing information, and when you don't fit in a room, now you have to like- How do you make sure everyone knows what's going on? The next physical infrastructure thing that changes is, like, you can't see each other.

You, like, e- even if you can fit in...

Could you take a step back for us and like where does the drive actually come from?

Right.

And so then it became an optimization problem.

But at least there was like an existence proof that it's possible to build a better search engine than Google, and that was very inspiring for me.

So then it was like, okay, like how do we optimize the hell out of that? And transformers had gotten really good at the time, and Google wasn't really leaning into it.

And we just had this deep belief in the bitter lesson, maybe more than Google, for search, which is that like if we could f- develop systems, like neural systems, where you pour more data into it, it just gets better and better for the thing we're optimizing for, then you could actually just totally be better than Google.

W- when we released this to the world in November 2022, like it was actually shocking, and Andrej Karpathy retweeted it.

It was pretty popular on Twitter.

Appreciate you, and very excited to be partners.

Right.

And so then it became an optimization problem.

But at least there was like an existence proof that it's possible to build a better search engine than Google, and that was very inspiring for me.

So then it was like, okay, like how do we optimize the hell out of that? And transformers had gotten really good at the time, and Google wasn't really leaning into it.

And we just had this deep belief in the bitter lesson, maybe more than Google, for search, which is that, like, if we could develop systems, like neural systems, where you pour more data into it, it just gets better and better for the thing we're optimizing for, then you could actually just totally be better than Google.

Wh-when we released this to the world in November twenty twenty-two, like, it was actually shocking, and Andrej Karpathy retweeted it.

It was pretty popular on Twitter.

Appreciate you and very excited to be partners.

Sure.

Yeah.

I mean, it's underhyped in most of the world and potentially a little bit overhyped in San Francisco.

But, so, like, but, like, basically, definitely underhyped.

Like, I have, yeah, I mean, I have a lot of, I grew up in New York City, and so, like, my family and friends, like, I'm the crazy, well, I have a lot of nieces and nephews.

I'm the crazy uncle who comes back to New York every so often.

It's, like, it's the, not it's the end times, but, like, this is going to change everything, and, like, you really should, like, adopt, change your worldview to, like, adopt this and it's really hard because it's very abstract so i think yeah maybe first thought is that this is a very abstract problem that's in the future it's not like covid well it's i mean it's similar to covid where like we heard this like virus spreading on a different continent and like those who follow the numbers and follow the graphs were like hey this is totally going to come here but then most people are like don't think that way even i didn't think well about covid like Even though I tend to follow the graph, it was like, it was too weird, like a virus that just like, in fact, everybody that was crazy.

What do you think?