How do you do that? How do you change the standard of care? How do you propose something like that?

Well, I think first of all, let's just talk about the difference between healing and curing.

We, uh, you know, it used to be that, that all we had was healing, right? [chuckles] All, all we had was support, and then we had a lot of attempts to cure people that weren't evidence-based.

Uh, we ha-have now unbelievable developments in science and technology, so we actually have a lot of tools, uh, that can help with the cure part.

And that fascinates us so much that we focus almost entirely on that in our system.

We pay for it in our system.

We do research on that.

You know, with everything you've studied and learned and lived about healing, you know, what has surprised you most? What has, what has created the biggest impact? What has, what has come out of nowhere that you couldn't have predicted?

Again, the military needed results, not theories.

And so we did a pragmatic study, which is what, you know, what does it look like compared to what normally they're getting? It's called treatment as usual.

They were getting psychotherapy.

They were getting a variety of things for stress relaxation.

Some of them were getting exposure in therapy.

They were on medications.

They were, uh, you know, they were getting group psychotherapy.

If anything, it's gotten worse.