As can I, what do you, what do you think? What do you think about all this?

Uh, you know, I think, I think we're heading in a better direction with horses.

Um, and I'm, I'm actually quite, quite big on consent these days, but I don't think, I don't think it's the, the thing you do as in, should you pat them, not pat them versus rub them, you know, should, you know, a lot of people like they, they think they're patting the horse and they're slapping them pretty hard.

I don't, I don't think that the consent thing's a bad thing, but like you said, it can get, you know, it can get to where it goes off on an extreme tangent to where People, you know, people are kind of drawn to like extreme tangents about things, but you know, as far as the altered, you know, I've, I have experienced altered states of consciousness through say breath work in ceremony, things like that.

I've not really experienced those states of consciousness through horses, but I think there might be kind of.

levels of it, but you have, you know, I had you on my podcast and well, the first time I had you on my podcast was about, tell me all about Rupert Isaacson and your amazing life.

But the second time I had you on, we were talking about hunter gatherers and you were talking about, you know, shape-shifting and that sort of thing, like inhabiting the consciousness of another being animal.

Hmm.

What would be some things you would tell our viewers that might be helpful for them if they're finding themselves in that kind of friction place or a place where their journey with their horse isn't quite matching the picture that they had maybe originally hoped for?

Great question, Paula.

I've had a number of perspective changes in the last eight years, but probably the thing that's really helped me the most, I have a podcast and three of my guests on the podcast had a perspective.

And I'll tell you what their perspective is.

The first one was a guy named Rupert Isaacson.

I don't know if you ever saw the movie, The Horse Boy or read the book, The Horse Boy.

It's about this guy has this highly autistic son.

So is there anything in the past, like when you worked with horses that, that you would, that you really wish you knew like a younger Warwick that you really wish you knew, or would you sort of have kept, kept your past the way it is because that's brought you to who you are today?