What are the human rights aspects of this? And what are the opportunities does this present in terms of enshrining human rights in legislation? I

like the point you raise around like, the marriage equality perhaps wasn't even on the minds of people in 1986.

Their fundamental goal was decriminalisation.

When I think of that, my reflection is that legal change, when it comes to human rights, and particularly for queer and trans people in this country, has always been a matter of incrementalism.

Yeah, we've done one thing, then we build on it, then we do another thing, and we build on it, we do another thing.

And that is... very tiring work for those for those involved but i mean look at the dividends and that's something that i always try to remember on laws in particular like there have been so many legal gains since 1993 and they've all been important so i really can't identify just one i do have a favorite though which i can talk about soon and in times of despair i think it is really important to remember the legal gains so i guess from my view perhaps it might be useful to recount some of the major ones.

I mean, like in 1995, two years after the Human Rights Act, we had the Births, Deaths, Marriages and Relationship Registration Act 1995, which introduced a statutory mechanism to enable adults to apply to the family court for a declaration that their birth certificates record their nominated sex.

I don't think that it is... good to have an environment where public discussion disregards the dignity and existence of some people.