Blacking out and super drunk.

You got it.

You got it.

And so now my whole thing is I'm very analytical and it was like, well, how do I deal with this? You know, all this trauma, all this pain.

And I'm like, I came up with a plan to blackmail my father.

And I was going to tell him that I want X thousand, you know, I know about your insurance fraud.

You think I don't know.

But I can't step foot in a church because the rules and regulations and just the mindset of a lot of these people it's like well that doesn't sound very christ-like that doesn't sound very open and giving and helping it it's a lot of especially nowadays politics gets thrown into church now and it becomes more politics than actual talking about god and I guess the benefits of being with him, you know, it's for lack of a better word, you know, but, and that's what really turns off a lot of people.

So can you walk us into the part of your life where you first looked into the metaphorical mirror and realized the person looking back wasn't white? who you had been pretending to be, what were you noticing and what was the cost of carrying that version of yourself for as long as you did?

Well, once again, there's probably many moments in my life, but the first moment was when I was a teenager back in the late 60s.

I was a creator, creative, uh, inventor.

I had a father, double, double major engineer.

Uh, and my goal was to have his attention.

I had two older brothers and nobody had his attention unless you sat down at the kitchen table to discuss math and engineering.

It was not...

and thank you for sharing it with us and before we end like we have come to the end of the show but I want to re-ask you like once a person begins to see themselves clearly they cannot unsee it the mirror is not closing again so as we move toward closing the section I want to ask like what does it look like to actually leave from that clearer view of selves like in the relationship in work in everyday choices and what does the world look like through the eyes of someone who has stopped performing it

So, uh, yeah, I mean, I suppose let's kinda just get into your own story first, because even though we've kinda discussed before, new audience, and, uh, kinda how your whole journey began.

Okay.

I'll try and make that short, 'cause I know we don't wanna take half the time just telling my story.

So, the short story is that at 16, I was dying of cancer, uh, terminal liver cancer.

My mother just died the year, uh, or just shortly before, um, from the same.

And, uh, it's in my first book, long story short, is that, um, I felt guilty that I had caused her cancer.

I was a 14-year-old boy, 15, uh, doing experiments with asbestos, trying to create an invention to help people, 'cause cars' brakes put out 60 million tons of asbestos a year back in the '60s, back in all the 1900s, actually.

Would you mind kind of elaborate a little bit on that one?

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The ruler, when the devil was kicked out of heaven and he was thrown to earth and we go, well, we have the Hollywood version of a red suit, long tail, pitchfork, ugly horns, ugly devil.

You know, Hollywood has taught us that medieval art.

That's not true.

The devil is the greatest, most powerful of all creations.

He's the most beautiful, it said, of all creations.

He didn't lose that when he got kicked out of heaven.

And what was the doctor's thoughts after seeing you after that?