It would have been almost impossible, I think.

Tom, what do you think? Well, I'm just glad that I'm not sitting in his seat because I cannot do what he does.

And thank you, Phil.

That's very kind words.

But I think at the same time, in terms of strategy, in terms of that viewpoint from a distributor's client, from an agency point of view, Phil has that in abundance through his expertise, through his career.

and although as Phil mentioned I'm very familiar with with our sector with our supply chain well I haven't got the greatest overview on which is you know thanks to Phil that's that's increasing is that is that a focus on distributor clients agencies brands what they need from us so I think we pair very well because yeah obviously Phil's found some expertise in where I am but equally the association as we as we are we need that expertise to move forward because for many a year um before my time during my time we've always focused on two specific pools of members and and that part of the supply chain be it um uk manufacturers importers decorators and on the other side of things the resellers And we've limited ourselves in the UK for many a year to speak to those guys intimately, but just speak to those guys.

Now, with Phil's viewpoint on it, and I think it's such a strong viewpoint about where we're going to go with this, we recognise that, we keep that, and that's a mature part of our conversation.

Tom, what has remained remarkably constant despite all these changes? There are a lot of changes, but what is the layer?