But it doesn't actually mean that that's who I am as a person, as my

personality can display.

Right, right.

Makes perfect sense.

That's what it is.

I read an interesting study.

Well, no, wrong, wrong.

How would a leader... going through all of that destruction right now, be able to use something like Surrounded by Idiots to help them to understand and reveal what that pressure is and how they can deal with it better? That's an excellent

And I think just to kick off, for our listeners that maybe haven't heard of you, um, haven't read your book, and I hope they, they now will, could you share a little bit about your trajectory into, into this world of, uh, human behavior and human psychology?

Of course.

Well, I, as many other people, stumbled into this by accident or, or may- may- may- maybe...

Well, by accident or maybe just because I, my, my general demeanor was not perfect when I was a young man.

I, I got my first managing position at the age of 24.

Uh, I was a good sales rep, so I thought if I could sell, I could probably lead the sales reps.

I could probably be a good team leader also, of course.

[laughs] Frame it for us for the, the four different types of, uh, of behavioral personalities.

What's your best piece of communications advice? The best piece of communication advice?

That would be, you will never change somebody else, but you can change yourself.

What's the best piece of communications advice?

And that's probably a sign that you're doing it maybe just close to enough.

The other thing to remember is communication isn't just about words and especially things like vision.

I think leaders probably communicate vision better through action than they do through words.

And certainly to the extent that you can find opportunities or maybe even create opportunities to live the vision that you want people to follow, that's maybe the best communication of all.