I mean, Thomas, okay, when was the first time you found, you watched this program?

Yeah, it's been in my consciousness since I can remember.

So I have the vaguest memories of seeing, I think, Megloss, which is a fairly underwhelming story in the final fourth Doctor season.

It's not very good.

Look, I don't mind it, but it's the one where the cactus takes on Tom Baker's shape, which is quite fun.

Oh, yeah, of course, the one with the cactus.

Yeah, the one with the cactus.

You've got a little bit of Dudley Simpson here for us, I believe.

What the hell were you even doing in that trial? Help, help me wrap my head around that, because it's a question that I've had for now three years.

There's no easy answer for that, and that's something that's kept Sharon and me awake for a long time.

In fact, my fellow defendants at the table would be talking, the defense table, they, they would be talking to their attorneys and saying the same thing: "What's Caldwell doing here? He's not one of us." But what happened was, is that the FBI and the DOJ had targeted me.

They had a rush to judgment because I, I knew a couple of the Oath Keepers, so you could say it was guilt by association.

And the Department of Justice and the FBI put out statements through the press saying that I was the big cheese.

I was the top banana.

It was my orders that caused the insurrection at the Capitol, and they went so far as to say that I'm, in fact, the commander of the Oath Keepers.

Yeah.