So moving forward more, I am curious to hear if you got a chance to be involved with ACI as a student or you, and, or how it helped you in your career in the long run.

Yeah, oddly enough, as a student, I was much more involved in ASCE than ACI.

I was involved in ACI through my graduate school experience, but I was not as active because I had thrown myself headfirst into A- ASCE.

And so they're very similar organizations.

You see a lot of overlap.

Students can only get involved in so much, especially good students, because good students tend to overcommit anyways.

I was involved peripherally as basically a user of the products, particularly as a young professional.

Hearing from your experience, if there's any suggestion for early career people to how to stay involved or how to find the right committee and how is it best to be in touch or be con- or contribute to the right place?