[laughs]

Five drags and we're... and I'm laying on the floor.

Um, and so I explained this to the guy.

Uh, firstly I went up to...

There was, there was a woman there first, and she said, "Look, I'm not the expert.

Let me get the expert." And some guy came from out the back, and he just ran me through everything, you know? And so it was really, it was really in- a very informed process.

And I went into another shop a week later, and it was the same.

Ooh

Yeah

... uh, you know, so I, I had a, a fairly positive attitude to it, although I was never a big user.

You know, I was like once every month back then I'd get a bit stoned at a party.

But then later in my career I moved to Peter Mac as the director of Psychosocial Oncology.

So I was running the, basically, uh, everything to do with social work, psychology, psychiatry, music therapy for cancer patients.

Big cancer hospital, Peter Mac, if people aren't familiar with it.

It, um, it's a statewide service, so it covers all of Victoria, and it's probably the nu- easily the number one cancer hospital in Australia.

Yeah

Are narcissists born? Is it genetic? Is it environmental? How is a narcissist created in the world?

Yeah, it's a really good question, and it's one of the hardest ones we have to answer.

And we always talk about nature and nurture.

Nature is, you know, how much it's in your genes, and nurture is how much is it, it's being brought up by your family, your parents, your friends, your schools, et cetera.

And we always say for personality, it's both, nature and nurture.

But the more and more research we do, the more it tends to come out that it's mostly nature.

It's mostly genes.

Steve, um, what, what do you have to say to Dionne?

Are narcissists born? Is it genetic? Is it environmental? How is a narcissist created in the world?

Yeah, it's a really good question, and it's one of the hardest ones we have to answer.

And we always talk about nature and nurture.

Nature is, you know, how much it's in your genes, and nurture is how much of it, it's been brought up by your family, your parents, your friends, your schools, et cetera.

And we always say for personality it's both nature and nurture.

But the more and more research we do, the more it tends to come out that it's mostly nature.

It's mostly genes.

Steve, um, what, what do you have to say to Dionne?