This is really interesting in light of the Reserve Bank's credit card surcharge ban on October 1.

Yes, exactly.

So we know that around 16% of small businesses were passing on the surcharge before the ban came into place.

Now, that might sound like a relatively small number, but there are 2.7 million small businesses in Australia.

So that was more than 300,000 small businesses that were passing on that surcharge.

The Tiro data suggests that But of those businesses, most of them at this point haven't passed on or haven't increased their prices, but have actually tried to absorb the cost.

Because obviously the credit card surcharge ban is in place, but those costs don't disappear.

It doesn't really surprise anyone to hear that people aren't willing to take that risk at the moment.

So maybe the first thing I'd love to dig into is what were the headline findings that you found or that Cosbo have found in compiling this report?

So this is an annual report, COSBOA does, but usually it's based on small businesses across the country.

We know that across the country, small businesses over the last two or three years have been working in really challenging economic conditions.

And what we wanted to do with this particular report is dig down a little bit deeper to get some greater insights into exactly how that is playing out in the regional, rural and remote areas and how those small businesses are adapting and coping.

What the survey told us is that it's tough times out there.

So we had around 600 small businesses participate and I am very grateful for the time they took out of the busy life of running a small business to put so many of their thoughts down on paper and share with us so we can use that in our advocacy for them.

But what they are telling us is that 9 out of 10 of them are saying that the costs of doing business for them have gone up over the last year.

What has the report called out, if any, how small businesses are coping with those current pressures right now?

A higher tax burden.

Yeah, a higher tax burden.

And I think the concerns that we are hearing from small businesses is that they are doing it hard right now.

They've set up their businesses as family trusts for really genuine reasons.

Family trusts are often better for succession planning, often better for asset protection, particularly useful if you have the sort of business where you have a bumpy income.

So they are genuine businesses operating through a genuine structure who now will have, as of the 1st of July, 2028, a higher tax burden.

The government's response is if you're not comfortable with that, you can restructure and look at a different sort of legal structure to operate your business through, which could get you a lower tax rate.

So what can the Council of Small Business Organisations Australia do now? What can you, Sky, in your capacity do to either effect change, to try and steer people in the right direction? Where does the organisation stand?

A higher tax burden.

Yeah, a higher tax burden and I think the concerns that we are hearing from small businesses is that they are doing it hard right now.

They've set up their businesses as family trusts for really genuine reasons.

Family trusts are often better for succession planning, often better for asset protection, particularly useful if you have the sort of business where you have a bumpy income.

So they are genuine businesses operating through a genuine structure who now will have, as of the 1st of July, 2028, a higher tax burden.

The government's response is if you're not comfortable with that, you can restructure and look at a different sort of legal structure to operate your business through, which could get you a lower tax rate.

But the costs and the paperwork of restructuring will be significant.

So what can the Council of Small Business Organisations Australia do now? What can you, Skye, in your capacity do to either effect change, to try and steer people in the right direction? Where does the organisation stand?

Is it kind of good news at least that we're focused a bit more on small business?

I think the concern about the capital gains tax changes was that they changed the risk reward balance.

Obviously, now there's some concessions for small business that take the direct impact of many small businesses.

But for medium businesses, that concern is still there.

That if you're a small business owner trying to grow into a medium business owner, you're often not paying yourself that much.

You're often not paying yourself super.

You're investing everything you can into growing the business as your priority and with the intention that that will become your retirement fund, that will support your future, that in a sense is your reward for all of the risk that you're taking now.

What's the next thing that you as head of COSBOA would like to see in a regulatory sense that would boost economic growth via small businesses?