We've seen him play before.

You have spells as players where I think every player at some point in their career will have a five, six.

You liar.

You liar.

Yeah.

Every player has a moment like that.

It's like thinking you want Adam Chambers.

We've set out the midfield as ball winners rather than players, effectively.

... reflections on that?

Yeah, so, so a really interesting question, to be honest, Kev.

The...

Matt has moved a few times.

So he, he started off at his local club.

After two years of being there and really enjoying it, um, he decided, and I stress that he decided, at 10 he was gonna move to Worcester Swimming Club, the, the big club locally, and he was gonna go to Worcester 'cause he wanted more time in the pool, he wanted, he wanted more.

So he decides he's gonna move.

But from your point of view, what have been some of the hardest bits that perhaps coaches don't often see, whether that's at home, whether that's the school, or whether that's the swimming journey itself that you just look back and go, "Oh, wow, they were some really hard things to navigate that probably only we as parents saw"?