Why is ROI such a different topic when leaders talk about Agile?

So I think what I've seen as a pattern is that, and this is normal for any sort of trend that we might have seen, and certainly in IT.

Something very big, you know, the big name companies are using it, we're going to do it too.

And so we're going to go agile.

And essentially, there's times I remember having conversations with leaders, like, why are you going agile? And then some way that they could try to feel comfortable with, they said, well, because everyone else is doing it.

So they didn't understand the value proposition of agile.

So I think this is a very relevant.

And as I said,