Let's start by describing how does someone from, uh, from what was then Yugoslavia come to Kansas to play basketball for Wichita State?

Well, actually, uh, uh, before you ask this question, I wanted to start, uh, the, uh, mm, with this explanation because, uh, uh, uh, actually it's really, really funny how it happened.

Uh, so, uh, uh, in those times, it was 1984, 1985, uh, I played, uh, mm, in Yugoslavia and I played for the whole national teams of Yugoslavia, and there was no money involved then in basketball.

And that, uh, then that first year, it was the first time I wasn't invi-invited to play for a national team.

So I was thinking, "Well, listen, I mean, what am I gonna do? If I don't play for national team, I might as well, uh, uh, uh, study something." But in those times there were not that many people really, uh, uh, playing, uh, from Europe in, in Uni-United States.

It would just happen on very, very random, uh, occasions.

And then I was thinking, well, my father had two PhDs, my mother is a lawyer, so I should make my family proud, so at least I, I, I would, uh, I should get a university degree.

Uh, describe your transition from basketball into the, uh, I guess I'll call it the construction, the home building industry, uh, and h- how did it go so smoothly for you?