But how did you feel led to do this and that work and how has that been fulfilling in your own life, this work in psychology and working with children and encouraging them towards these practices of being silent and turning down the noise?

Yeah, well, I actually started similar to you.

I started with the Bachelor in Psychology and wasn't sure, but I was actually working at the time in youth ministry at a church in Australia.

And that was, I was serving there for quite a few years and working with particularly junior high and high school students.

And I think it was during that time that I just really felt God leading me into more study, which is when I went and did the Masters in Educational Psychology.

And As I was literally finishing that degree, like handing in my final thesis, I got a phone call from my doctor to say that they'd found a lump on my neck and that he was clearing his schedule.

You need to come in immediately.

How do you think that experience shaped you to become not only the mother and wife, but the researcher and psychology expert that you are today?