But this National Church Life Survey, how do you encourage Christian believers to embrace this with real enthusiasm?

Yeah, I think there's multiple layers that we can talk about.

And let me start perhaps with that individual voice.

It is a chance.

We could just do research on a little sample of people.

You know, we could get a sample of Australians and say, right, we know what the patterns are.

But what we do is we actually say every voice matters and we listen to children.

who have

In determining his sentence, the judge asked a few questions about Sergio's income, because there would be a financial element to the punishment.

What I would have expected when you're asking somebody about their ability to pay compensation is that you would want proof of what their income is.

But it was just a really weird line of questioning along the lines of, "How much do you earn?" And he would give the answer.

Didn't ask for any documentary evidence.

"Who are you supporting at home?" "Well, I'm supporting my wife and children, an elderly mother who lives in a home." "How much does that cost you to do that?" It was, it, it was all taken at his word, w- and that might be the way, the right way that it's done.

But, so it just seemed as if the judge was accepting everything that he said about his financial position, which may have been correct, but it may not have been, and it wasn't interrogated.

She'd been to see him before the sentencing to explain to him the enormous growing caseload she had of people who said they'd been harmed by Dr. Sergio.

And then when we got off at Johannesburg, you kind of get off the plane, and you walk through that funny old bit in airports where the loos are and everything, and then you get to a bit where there's an escalator that goes down, and then you kind of set free.

They passed it onto another law firm who specialize in clinical negligence, and so it ended up on the desk of Ruth Powell.

How did I get into the law? I went and did some questionnaire when I was about 16, one of those cascade questionnaires, and they said, "Do you like working outside? Do you like working with animals? Do you like investigations?" And the three top things that came up were journalist, barrister, solicitor.

I better go too And low clouds, rain, strong winds.

It fills me with repulsion and outrage that he came here, and he felt like he could do whatever he wanted to do, to whoever he wanted to, and there was gonna be no comeback.