So what are some of those symptoms of, like, how we got here? Let's dive into it.

Yeah.

Okay.

Well, let me start with what I think people are probably feeling today, right? So, so as I led each of those organizations, whether it was user experience or it was analytics or MarTech in the tech side, uh, media, I, I think everybody in those organizations feels like there's something wrong with the...

Like, we could be doing so much more with what we do here.

Like, we're so underutilized to this problem of growth or whatever the company is trying to solve.

And I think that feeling comes from very siloed organizations, right? I think, um, I think I see the problem that chief marketing officers, chief growth officers, chief commercial officers have spent a lot of money over the last 10 to 20 years buying software, buying capability, hiring teams, building teams, and largely I don't think that they're getting a large percentage of the potential value all, o- o- out of all of that investment that they've made.

And so I wanna talk a little bit about, like, who needs to be involved in some of this transformation, and how do these groups kind of work together? Because like Julie said, getting an organization to, like, put aside your [laughs] segmentation that you've been so emotionally [laughs] like, your crutch for the past however many years to something that you're talking about with this transformation, like, talk a little bit more about, like, what that takes and, and who you have to get bought in.