Is that right?

And that is exactly right, and that's what happened.

I mean, Thames decided to do their own preschool program and, and eventually came up with Rainbow.

And, um, I remember because Pamela Lonsdale, the original producer, ca- I was working at the Little Angel Puppet Theatre, which of course is where I started my, my whole career, and, um, she turned up at, with a researcher, at the workshop n- next door to the theater.

Uh, I think she'd probably phoned up the original director, John Wright, and said, "Look, you know, we'd like to come discuss possible puppet-making job or something." Anyway, she came up and she chatted away to John.

I was in the workshop making a...

Well, I wasn't making, but some friends were making a set of puppets for me for shows at the theater.

'Cause they, they're still, they're still with us, aren't they?

theatre?

In London.

Oh, where's that? Oh, it's in Islington, North London.

So I said, well, I can go to Stockwell.

It's on the Northern line.

And I started to visit the theatre.

It was basically founded by a man called John Wright.

was it