But, but I do think, you know, there's been some opportunism by our longtime friends, um, and all in the name of this kind of, you know, faith in economic integration.

Well, look, one way to approach this is at, at the biggest level, um, globalization, which you introduced with, is not going away.

So if you look at trade, if you look at movement of people, you look at capital, you look at diseases and pandemics, um, that globalization is going with us.

It's gonna, it's not gonna be stopped.

However, what's changed is the governance of globalization, the rules, the fragmentation.

So this brings us to the second point.

What you described is the benefits of economic interdependence, but what the world has also seen is that you can weaponize interdependence, and the United States has been weaponizing interdependence.

Do you think that our large institutions and organizations and governments in general are equipped to handle the world as it is while it's this unstable? Or what do they need to do differently moving forward in this period?

Right.

But, but in particular, gee, we fought with the Canadians in World War I, World War II, Korean War.

They fought and died with us in Afghanistan.

At 9/11, they helped take care of some of our people.

They helped ...

Here we're in, in another conflict with Iran.

In the first one, the Canadians helped get people out.

Right

That's one of the authorities.

But in particular, gee, we fought with the Canadians in World War I, World War II, Korean War.

They fought and died with us in Afghanistan.

At 9-11, they helped take care of some of our people.

They helped, here we're in another conflict with Iran.

In the first one, the Canadians helped get people out.

That's a national security threat? So this goes to the point that Kritz mentioned.

when our alignment needs to be with the Western market democratic model rather than the state-backed one that China is using to dominate various sectors and various societies.

Right.

But, but in particular, gee, we fought with the Canadians in World War I, World War II, Korean War.

They fought and died with us in Afghanistan.

At 9/11, they helped take care of some of our people.

They help here in, in another conflict with Iran.

In the first one, the Canadians helped get people out.

That's a national security threat? So this goes to the point that Chris mentioned.

Right

paper stuff that my grandfather has in his wallet? Yeah, that's right, that's exactly right, it's

what you buy crypto with.

On the bottom it says Novus Ordo Seclorum, New Order of the Ages.

So, as Michael said, these gentlemen, at that time they were gentlemen, were thinking about sort of bigger aims and objectives.

But they're also, they're ruthlessly pragmatic.

I mean, so they had to survive in a difficult world.

Frankly, Ben Franklin negotiated a heck of an agreement in 1783, gave us all the territory up to the Mississippi.

Bob, do you think that's right? Long memories of our allies, that they will remember America?

Before we get to talking about the role that America most recently, as we think of as a modern superpower, uh, take us back to the founding of this nation and what was our foreign policy, if one could glean such a thing, when we were just that small group of colonies?

Well, it starts that, William, I think the United States has always had a higher purpose.

Uh, but that purpose has evolved over time.

So in 1789, it was simply to survive as a republic in a world of empires.

Uh, and during the Civil War, as Lincoln said, it was to preserve the Union as the last best hope, uh, for the global world.

Um, for Woodrow Wilson in World War I, it was to make the world safe for democracy, not to make everybody democracies.

For, uh, Franklin Roosevelt, it was the four freedoms.

Bob, do you think that's right? Long memories of our allies, that they will remember America?