in Ibogaine that you feel was such a game changer for you?

I think for me, you know, obviously at this time, this was 2021 when I first went.

I've gone multiple times.

I've done Ibogaine three times.

But in 2021 was my first time with, you know, drastic change.

And so going through it, you know, for me, it was right because I had so much self-hatred towards myself because of my, you know, what things I thought as failures, whether that was my career, whether it was being a husband, all these things I had just I had zero love for myself.

And and going through Ibogaine, right, it was like a movie.

For

You know, listening to a podcast.

Yeah, no, it was.

And again, it was back to the, you know, how I was raised, how my mentality as an athlete was like, I didn't want to give up.

Right.

I kept searching and searching.

And I did.

I heard it on a podcast, heard on Marcus Luttrell's Team Never Quit podcast.

And does it, does it get easier? I know that first time you did it, it was like, you were like, you talked about like, well, I couldn't walk for like a bit and you know, it, it kind of knocks you on your butt a little bit, but yeah, You know, just talk about what that process is and how often you go back.

I guess, you know, what do you want fans to know about the realities of life after football? And why is this such an important topic for you to talk about and to be open about with your life?

I think the biggest thing is that as much as this game gave me, the reality is for all of us who play it and other sports, not just football, that go on and play professionally and in college is that the game takes a lot from you and that's what this whole conversation started about was, you know, especially in my sport, you know, with football and other contact sports, the, the effects of, uh, you know, of the TBIs of the subconcussive blows, right.

It has a real effect on our brains and what it does to us post-career.

And I think we're learning that as a society.

So for all the fans out there, right.

And then now I'm a fan of, of these guys, these young kids playing, but, uh, I want everyone to notice and recognize what the game, what these sports take from these athletes, and we all would do it all over again.

I'm very thankful for the opportunity I had.

And tell us all about this, you know, kind of the panel you've put together and, and what the purpose of this event is coming up on the second.

I guess, what do you want fans to know about the realities of life after football? And why is this such an important topic for you to talk about and to be open about with your life?

I think the biggest thing is that as much as this game gave me, the reality is for all of us who play it and other sports, not just football, that go on and play professionally and in college, is that the game takes a lot from you.

what this whole conversation started about was, you know, especially in my sport, you know, with football and other contact sports, the, the effects of, you know, of the TBIs of the subconcussive blows, right.

It has a real effect on our brains and what it does to us post-career.

And I think we're learning that as a society.

So for all the fans out there, right.

And then now I'm a fan of, of these guys, these young kids playing, but again, I want everyone to notice and recognize what the game, what these sports take from these athletes, and we all would do it all over again.

And tell us all about this, you know, kind of the panel you've put together and, and what the purpose of this event is coming up on the second.

Uh, what did that transition out of football look like fr- um, on your end?

Yeah, I think it was like, you know, any professional or any person that does something for a very long time, when you're done, especially in sports, you know, when you're done, you're done, right? When, when, especially in professional sports, you know, when you, you know, if you're a-- I have a friend who's a, a, a rock star, right? He can, he can, he's still at a very high level, but, you know, a singer can continue to sing and do, do their craft.

Where, uh, athletes, when you're done, it's typically 'cause your, your body gives up and, and you get to an age you can't do it anymore.

So I went through all the, all the emotions of, of, of that, you know, and, uh, kinda my identity, 'cause up to for, you know, 20 years, that was my identity through college and, and the professionals.

And, uh, that's, that's who I was.

That's what you got up every day.

That's what you trained for.

What did I fucking do to myself, right? [chuckles]

Mm

... uh, to the Raiders, and then spent seven seasons in Oakland with the Raiders.

Um, signed with the Seahawks after that.

Played a year there, had some mounting injuries, got released, and then went to New England, uh, for camp, and then couple weeks in I, you know, told coach that I was retiring.

I was just mentally and physically, I was done.

And, um, that's kinda what started, that's where the big part of my journey started, and that was, you know, being done, uh, as a professional, right? I went through all the things that every professional does, not just athletes, right? It's the lack of identity.

It's the schedule.

Mm-hmm

You know, the lack of identity, the locker room,

you miss that community you had.

And so topping that was I started having some cognitive issues from all the TBI that I had while I was playing.

And through that, I...

We listened to a veteran podcast, heard about this therapy, psychedelic-assisted therapy with Ibogaine that these veterans were doing to help fix and improve their TBI symptoms.

So long story short, went to Mexico with some special ops veterans, did this treatment with Ibogaine, and it completely changed my life.

It took me from... you know deep depression substance abuse suicidal ideation to a functioning human being again and so i wanted to help other athletes because there's a lot of athletes that suffer we suffer in silence just like the veterans yeah right they don't want to ask for help uh neither do we and and i finally did and so you know i started athletes for care to to help with these you know to help mitigate some of these symptoms that we all have from tbi and to to give resources and to to talk about it, right? It's more of a mental health thing than anything.

they

Mm-hmm.

Even if, you know, maybe not all the time, so this is going to mess them up.

Um, and then I saw what it actually did to them.

Woke up out of this, I actually started throwing up, so I reacted to, you know...

And I think I woke up in, kind of towards the end of this trip, and so I thought I'd died.

So they're cleaning my mouth, right, because I'm puking, and they're cleaning my mouth out.

And I start raging, because I thought, I literally think I'm dead.

Have you gotten a brain scan since the first one you got where it was like, it looked like somebody took a baseball bat to it?