So how does that feature within the European landscape? What's your take on that, please?

Yes, thank you, Daniel.

I think it's quite an interesting moment that we have here in Europe because what we're looking at in European policymaking when it comes to this area of geoeconomics is something that I think we're witnessing in the Indo-Pacific, as you say, countries such as Korea, Japan, Taiwan, and never mind China, of course, have always treated geoeconomics as central to their security.

You could argue even to their identity as highly advanced economies.

And I think in Europe until not so long ago, we still saw this through the prism of liberalism, liberal institutions, and WTO, of course.

And that has clearly shifted in recent years.

And the main reasons, of course, being China and Russia's invasion of Ukraine, but more recently also the US policy under President Trump.

But Ramon, I want to maybe invite you on that basis to share with us some of the views or ideas that you picked up, especially from some of our European counterparts at the Brussels Korea Forum, as you answer this question on how you believe Europe and Korea can intensify their cooperation.

Explain South Korea's decision not to get involved as, as so many other countries did not do, at least in the initial stages and, and whether or not South Koreans feel that that was the correct decision at the time.

I, I, I think that the South Korean position is, um, not difficult to understand because it's [laughs] very similar to the one we have here in the UK and other European countries, which is we don't want really to be part of a blockade, uh, of the Strait of, uh, Hormuz.

If there's going to be a multilateral mission to, uh, make sure that, uh, the waters of the strait remain open, South Korea's willing to participate, but so far we haven't seen this type of, uh, mission.

South Korea supports diplomacy.

South Korea has sided with the part of the criticism of the US on, on, on Iran and their agreement that they want to pursue, uh, nuclear weapons.

But obviously, South Korea also understands that this war was started by the US and Israel.

It's not going to criticize, uh, any of the two for starting this war.

Do you think, Professor, that this part of the world has fully grasped that Donald Trump is doing what he said he was going to do, that they are withdrawing to their own hemisphere of influence, and that this is a part of the world that they will not have the same level of involvement with that they have historically?