So also a different way of thinking about the economy in the Global South, which I think is also quite powerful to think or to place supply side climate policies, not only as, let's say, a policy, but rather a part of a broader transformation of the economy.

So the UK case study is, is one that, uh, I looked at with, with Freddy.

It was, is very interesting, um, partly 'cause the country, as, as you'll know and your colleagues at Sheffield definitely know, um, has been through quite an unjust transition, right? So we basically, we looked at three, um, supply side policy contestations or sites.

Um, firstly looking at the coal transition, but really just in particular its ongoing legacy and the shadow to some extent that it casts over current supply side policy decisions, and in particular decisions around licenses in, uh, for oil and gas in the North Sea, which we're seeing very live and contentious debate around, uh, right now around Rosebank and, and Jackdaw and so on.

Um, so with-- the coal was the first instance, trying to sort of understand the dynamics around how that was possible.

Again, that was, as you know, the coal phase, that was not really a climate-driven policy.

It was around a broader sort of, uh, Thatcherite restructuring of the economy and a, a shift towards s-supporting finance capital and away from trying to break the power of trade unions, et cetera.

And alongside that, what you think the core takeaways are for what I guess would be required to like advance and accelerate these, um, supply side climate policies.

need to

i mean i think i think it's um i mean it's a very very difficult moment to be having as i was writing that chapter i guess it was um you know a couple of years ago probably um And possibly things have got worse since then, really, in terms of the democratic moment and the rollback of liberalism and the rise of populism and all of those sorts of things.

It's very, you know, when you're writing things around, oh, there could be climate assemblies and there could be participatory budgeting and let's open up all these spaces.

And, you know, those things are important and you can find examples of them still.

But there clearly is also a closing down of civic space in so many different contexts.

Yeah.

In fact, a project I was involved with recently with colleagues at the Institute of Development Studies was around that, was around energy transitions and just transitions, but the role of civic space.

How does that square with moving away from governing the environment towards transformations? Can we govern the environment towards transformations might be the bigger question to take up the title of the book.