So let's say we spent €20 million in the last two years on cybersecurity tooling and processes and improvements, but that doesn't necessarily mean you're resilient.

Exactly.

And I think the cyber one makes it quite easy actually to show as well.

So now, and I'm sure that the listeners, you know, wherever in whatever organization you are, there's a whole spectrum of how if we take the from the AI, for example, right, that's, that's a really great example, what's your strategy for all the developments, all these models that we very little human interaction and intervention can actually, you know, connect different vulnerabilities, even low level ones, and then escalate that at a speed that's very, basically impossible for humans to catch.

you can take multiple different strategies here, right? And some take that I need to prevent even more, I need to patch even faster, I need to ingrain certain practices even deeper, access management, network segmentation, all of these things, and they're incredibly helpful also from a resilience perspective, right? So network segmentation, isolation, redundancy, immutability, right? These are all great capabilities that you can put in place beforehand.

But believing that all this stuff will help you, that nothing ever will happen, and then you never have to even worry about getting to a situation where you have to respond, I think that's the biggest misconception.

between security and resilience.

Therefore, decisions need to be balanced in the pragmatism of profitability and all of those things.