Um, you talk, for example, in the book about the creation of seawalls and how kind of looking at those processes also might complicate some of these ideas about natural capital.

Yeah.

I mean, the seawall was again a sort of, you know, in anthropology we're, we're kind of fond of, of objects to think with.

Um, and the seawall was a, a good object to think with, right? Part of producing models about, um, ecosystem services in the context of marine environments is understanding the relationship between the marine environment, the sea and, and the land, right? And, and the modeling oftentimes really dependent upon creating a strong distinction, right, between the, these boundaries, right? Creating a strong boundary between the sea and the land, just like it also was premised to some degree on a, a, on a larger boundary, that boundary that we think of between nature and culture, between people and their environment, right? Um, which has, you know, an obviously a longer history in Western thought of this kind of binary thinking of the relationship between nature and culture.

In some ways, the way that people thought about the relationship between land and sea seemed to me like an extension of that relationship between nature and culture.

It was this boundary that had to be maintained even though everyday lived experience says that boundary is not nearly as neat as we imagine it to be.

Um, that's especially the case in Belize, right? Belize, um, much to the disappointment of a lot of visitors and beachgoers, doesn't really have in most places like the kind of classic sandy beach where land gives way to the ocean in this kind of clean way.

To what extent do these ideas we've been talking about in terms of natural capital and valuing what's happening and what is there in Belize, how much does all of this influence politics?

You talk, for example, in the book about the creation of seawalls and how kind of looking at those processes also might complicate some of these ideas about natural capital.

Yeah, I mean, the seawall was, again, a sort of, you know, in anthropology, we're kind of fond of objects to think with.

And the seawall was a good object to think with, right? Part of producing models about ecosystem services in the context of of marine environments is understanding the relationship between the marine environment, the sea, and the land.

And the modeling oftentimes really depended upon creating a strong distinction between these boundaries.

creating a strong boundary between the sea and the land, just like it also was premised to some degree on a larger boundary, that boundary that we think of between nature and culture, between people and their environment, which has obviously a longer history in Western thought of this kind of Thank you so much for having me.

That's especially the case in Belize, right? Belize, much to the disappointment of a lot of visitors and beachgoers, doesn't really have in most places like the kind of classic sandy beach where land gives way to the ocean in this kind of clean way.

Because of the barrier reef, you have this complex ecosystem where you have a kind of lagoon behind the barrier reef and a seagrass.

To what extent do these ideas we've been talking about in terms of natural capital and valuing what's happening and what is there in Belize, how much does all of this influence politics?

Um, you talk for example in the book about the creation of seawalls and how kind of looking at those processes also might complicate some of these ideas about natural capital.

Yeah.

I mean, the seawall was again a sort of, you know, in anthropology we're, we're kind of fond of, of objects to think with.

Um, and the seawall was a, a good object to think with, right? Part of producing models about, um, ecosystem services in the context of marine environments is understanding the relationship between the marine environment, the sea, and, and the land, right? And, and the modeling oftentimes really depended upon creating a strong distinction, right, between the, these boundaries, right? Creating a strong boundary between the sea and the land.

Just like it also was premised to some degree on a, on a larger boundary, that boundary that we think of between nature and culture, between people and their environment, right? Um, which has, you know, an obviously a longer history in Western thought of this kind of binary thinking of the relationship between nature and culture.

In some ways, the way that people thought about the relationship between land and sea seemed to me like an extension of that relationship between nature and culture.

It was this boundary that had to be maintained even though everyday lived experience says that boundary is not nearly as neat as we imagine it to be.

To what extent do these ideas we've been talking about in terms of natural capital and valuing what's happening and what is there in Belize, how much does all of this influence politics?

Um, you talk for example in the book about the creation of sea walls and how kind of looking at those processes also might complicate some of these ideas about natural capital.

Yeah.

I mean, the seawall was again a sort of, you know, in anthropology we're, we're kind of fond of, of objects to think with.

Um, and the seawall was a, a good object to think with, right? Part of producing models about, um, ecosystem services in the context of marine environments is understanding the relationship between the marine environment, the sea and, and the land, right? And, and the modeling oftentimes really depended upon creating a strong distinction, right, between the, these boundaries, right? Creating a strong boundary between the sea and the land.

Just like it also was premised to some degree on a, on a larger boundary, that boundary that we think of between nature and culture, between people and their environment, right? Um, which has, you know, an obviously a longer history in Western thought of this kind of binary thinking of the relationship between nature and culture.

In some ways, the way that people thought about the relationship between land and sea seemed to me like an extension of that relationship between nature and culture.

It was this boundary that had to be maintained even though everyday lived experience says that boundary is not nearly as neat as we imagine it to be.

To what extent do these ideas we've been talking about in terms of natural capital and valuing what's happening and what is there in Belize, how much does all of this influence politics?