So, like, why was there ever, like, thought or discussion about, like, we could play Torchbearer, which is very complicated, or we could play original D&D, which is much less complicated, right? Well, I mean, we all did play

original D&D, you know? I started playing D&D when I was six.

So it's like, I remember that, but there was something, this actually gets right to the heart of the matter, which is, I mean, the best aspects of Torchbearer are the ones that re-examine the D&D tropes through the artistic medium of game rules.

Um, and they tell you, they say, they say, oh, this is how things, you know, this, they take a, they nod towards how the older approach worked, but like, there's some really destructive stuff in there.

And I don't, I don't necessarily mean politically.

I mean, uh, but although, although yes, uh, but also, um, destructive to the game experience that, uh, memetically have just been passed down over and over and over again.

And it's like, it manifests in our, our, our, our world outside of games all the time.

yeah a little bit yeah yeah