And later on in the podcast, Nicola is going to give us a little bit of a preview and a walkthrough for anyone that hasn't met your lovely self before do you want to let us all know a little bit more about yourself?

Yeah thank you and thank you so much I feel honoured to come and it was so lovely to recently meet you at a book launch and an event with PDA Parenting so it was really lovely.

Yeah so our experience started 10 years ago I mean it started way before that but It was a chance conversation that I had with a friend.

I described a situation to her of how I'd actually asked one of my boys to stop not necessarily having, I don't like the word meltdown anymore, but, you know, could they do something and calm down? And it just spiraled.

And I was explaining the details and the situation.

And my friend said to me, you might want to look up PDA, pathological demand avoidance.

And I was like, what? And I was so overwhelmed at the time, I actually typed and texted myself those three letters because I knew that I'd be like, what did they say? Ten days later, due to, it was between the, Christmas and new year, something happened and it really got me to think maybe I need to look this up.

Thank you for the opportunity.