bit problematic at the moment

and we don't want to lose that from the narrative and we keep it very much as part of how we position ourselves.

Today we talk about being culture experts and being people risk experts and we sort of try and get the balance right between positive workplace culture conversations and balancing and managing those people risks.

The truth is that actually what you're really in control of, of an organization, is where most companies should focus right now.

And I think it's interesting, you can draw different parallels in different parts of cultural, but if I focus in on a little bit more of my previous background, say well-being as an example, There's been a lot of money spent by organizations on well-being, products, benefits, perks, systems, apps, etc.

I've been part of that world.

I've seen the effort and energy that went into it.

And we're frequently in conversations now, sort of ESG, but how are you seeing that play out with the companies that you're working with?