And what was that process like? What did they go through to try to figure out or like again i don't want to answer for you but i know that often um when people are starting out and they're trying to work through the mechanisms of things like this what was that process for you guys like what did you guys do to try to refine that down

so the base idea um needed quite a bit of refinement actually and and we thought you know we had something good and if You're a game designer out there.

You know, as soon as you hit that first playtest table, things never go the way you plan.

So for us, we did a lot of refinement together.

But where we really started getting the...

the game to be that gem was when we took it out and started playing at a local game test nights.

So we just had a copy that was like written on paper.

before bananaarchy was there any did you tinker with design at all like was there any earlier attempts that you because i get this a lot when i talk to people they're like you know what this was kind of when if things finally clicked but before that you know tinkering and ideas and kind of working through concepts that maybe didn't flush out but it got kind of their beak wet so to speak in terms of the design side was there other iterations of other things you worked on prior to