So where did your experience with them start? How did they come into your world?

Yeah, it's quite interesting.

As a university student, I was a bit of a party girl, but I never touched anything psychedelic.

I was terrified of I was like, no, I don't want to hallucinate.

I don't want to lose control.

I don't want to, yeah, I just was like really scared that I would lose my mind.

And then it was just before COVID and I was in a place in my life where I had a really, like I had a lovely couple of businesses.

But what happens when you're taking a bigger amount at a retreat? What is that experience? What causes? what happens what changes like don't tell