Wild West times, Mark?

Well, it was.

And, uh, when, uh, we were coming up to the near death of Lloyds i- in the late '90s, which I, was the other watershed case for me acting for the, uh, E&O insurers and the members agents and the managing agents.

Um, I mean, okay, there were quite a few naughty boys involved in all of that, but there was this thing called the spiral, um, which was everybody reinsuring everyone's dirty laundry up and up and up and up.

So for instance, Piper Alpha, Dick Ous- Outhwaite, a very well-known underwriter at the time.

He knew everything was in Lloyds, and he knew it was a 2 billion loss, and he went round and he took notes of what every syndicate had, and it just totaled under a billion.

And he said, "Where's the rest?" And the answer was no one had the first idea.

Yeah.