What is it about the phrase service office that you don't like and what would you say are some of the misconceptions about service offices?

Well, it's very interesting really because when I started, one of the reasons that I thought there was an opportunity in inverted commas service offices is that they had a stigma.

the only people that went to service offices, or the only businesses that went to service offices were those that didn't have a strong enough covenant to take longer leases.

And so they were sort of thought of as small businesses putting their toe in the water.

And I thought that's not right, actually, because the alternative is a commitment to a lease.

And I have set about trying to turn that around, and we're still trying to turn it around at Bloxham, I think with success now at last, turning it around so that there's it's not a stigma it's actually if you go if if you have an office at Blocks and Bell we're hoping that it adds credibility to your business and people say well if they're Blocks and Bell there must be an okay business um so and and the big change for us um came from WeWork now WeWork was a actually flawed concept for the simple reason they didn't own their properties.

And it's a very difficult thing to do if you don't own your property because you can't – for one thing, you're letting short-term and paying long-term rent.

What are your perceptions of leadership? What is it about leadership that fascinates you?