And with that said, with respect to the topic of UAP and disclosure, how do you approach it in your attempt to make sense over these years? What frames, what lenses do you bring?

Well, you know, you meet the strange where you are, right? And so I think it's right to observe that at the time of my first UFO encounters as an adult, I was freshly graduated college.

from an undergraduate program in evolutionary biology.

I was at a turning point in my life where what I thought I was doing and had monomaniacally committed to for, at that point, 23 years, had started to fall apart.

And The paleontological field crew that I was utterly committed to working with was unraveling due to political infighting.

The PhD letters I was sending in for application to various schools.

I never even sent because I had fallen in love with somebody who still had a couple of years of school ahead of her.

Sure.