Yeah.

You know, my mom was like overly flowing with love and care.

And but like what my therapist called emotional enmeshment.

which is like, there would be like too much emotion, like pouring into me.

And then, you know, my dad was always very supportive of me.

And as time went on, like I started to, de-mesh myself emotionally from my mom.

And like, it was okay to upset her.

What did you want to make sure? Oh, I've been writing down things all

What happened in your life that helped you realize that conflict isn't necessarily something to avoid?

Yeah, so this was not my mindset for the first 30, 35 years of my life.

So when I started my first company, it started off great.

I had a co-founder.

We were building it.

It was gaining excitement and media, and it had a lot of traction out of the gate.

And we continued to build it and grow it.

to not wanting to jump into conflict as like a good thing i'm just i don't like conflict it's it's a good thing you don't have to worry about me because i don't like conflict what do you say to people who really just struggle like i'm not confrontational because a lot of times i think those people when they do bring up and jump into conflict they say things that they'll regret right and you want to avoid that i assume right

Mm-hmm.

But my invitation is instead of avoiding it or minimizing it, we need to leverage it.

Conflict is only a signal that something is out of alignment.

So when we can say what needs to be said authentically and directly and take care of the other person, be compassionate, be curious, that's where we have that kind of like Goldilocks.

You were talking about friction and tension.

That's where we can leverage that tension, and I would say even more than resolution, 'cause one, we can use conflict to solve the problem.

That's great.

If, if you're, if you're with a team or in a business where there isn't any conflict, should you worry that you're probably not bringing out the genius, that you're probably not doing the things you need to do to find the, the challenges that give you success?