And then, and so when you first started, did you, um, Is that how it started? You were like, I'm going to get these manufactured and then fulfill them and sell them for people? Or did you decide you wanted to do your own thing? Or how did that kind of

start? I was foolish.

I got a bug up my ass about Golden Demon.

The first Golden Demon that they did online was the inception of Smash Bash.

The first Golden Demon they did online I like built this like really big thing and I thought it was really cool.

In retrospect, it was, it's fine.

It's not really, it's not cool.

Because even if you're a fighter, you're a barbarian in Dungeons & Dragons, 5th

I promise.

And so, you know, I thought like, hey, what's the what's the easiest way to kind of get people to have a tabletop role playing experience? And.

You know, the people who I made Sunrat for and who it's still for are people who have minis and boards that want people to play games that don't require you to do homework.

Right.

It's like a no homework game.

And I think.

almost all tabletop role-playing games are homework games and many board games are homework games.

when you say you, is that the group or each player?

Uh, but, um, what, what got you from Nurgle poxwalkers to I'm gonna mash all of this stuff together and make something that looks even more sick?

Yeah.

There were two, there were two really...

There, there were, there, I think there were, like, two sort of inflection points for me that, like, sort of brought me to this pl- to, that brought me here.

Three, but two.

So, um, looking at all the different models, I was like, and, like, looking at the Games Workshop paint stuff, I was like, "This isn't quite...

Like, this is cool, but I can't do this," you know? Like, I know that I can.

Um-